Prime Oscar De la hoya vs 2007 Floyd Mayweather 147

If you strip all the bull**** away from DLH; his fame, his personality, his ego, his business acumen, his later years as a part-time celebrity fighter, if you forgot all that and just remember him for what he was in his welterweight prime, then you have to accept that he was a wonderful fighter.

I believe that DLH would have physically bullied Mayweather, and if that wasn't enough, DLH would just outwork him. DLH had a difficult style for Mayweather to overcome, we saw that when an ageing part-time DLH pushed Mayweather very hard for six rounds or so.

 

I dunno. I don't see him and Pacquiao being able to work out a deal. There not much out there, From what I'm hearing if Canelo beats Lopez, then Canelo vs Cotto will happen in Decemeber. If Martinez wins, then a fight between him and Floyd may happen, both sides have shown an interest in making it happen, however I don't think it will happen straight away because Floyd would probably take a tune a fight. If the Floyd were to take a tune up fight, the front runners are Devon Alexander and Robert Guerrero. However the problem with Guerrero is that Floyd a PPV figther and Golden Boy think they can stack enough on a floyd vs Guerrero card to make it a PPV however HBO do not want to make it a PPV because they don't think that fight would make a profit. So my guess if Floyd were to fight it would be a tune up against Devon Alexander. There is no guarantee Floyd may even fight again. He said after the Cotto fight there a big chance he could retire.

 

Great post! thanks a lot for that! I definitely think Floyd's got 2 possibly even 3 fights left in him.

Regards, Loudon.

 

Floyd would of stood and the middle of the ring and been able to out muscle ODH while infighting @ 147, Oscar would of received a brutal beating if he decided to slug like he seemingly did in some of his fights, if ODH chose to box and move he probably could win 4-5 rounds

 

Great reply, thanks!

Was there no middle ground with the 30 day cut off? I know Manny didn't want to be tested right up until the last 14 days. But didn't they start arguing over other cut off days? I may be wrong, but I'm sure the last I heard they were arguing over two dates, that were only about 4 days apart or something daft.

I perfectly understand where you're coming from regarding the authority, and also you've made a great example using Bradley. But again, even though they don't want to rock the boat, and lose their chance of a huge payday, I think that if his opponents were adament he was on something, some of them definitely would want him to be tested like Floyd. Maybe guys like Clottey wouldn't want to lose a big payday, but not someone like Cotto and Marquez. Marquez has had 3 wars with him, and they're talking about a 4th fight. There's no way in hell that Marquez would fight Manny if he wasn't happy.

Maybe Manny is just a freak of nature? He reminds me of Bruce Lee with his physique. Roy went up through 3 divisions and kept his speed and power, although obviously Manny is a lot smaller than Roy. But it's happened before. It's not as though Manny's been knocking out 154 pounders is it? He's obviously going to hit a little harder as he moves up.

I know Floyd's going to take the same test. But what I'm saying is, Manny's basically being attacked by this, and he's been sticking to his guns, I think, to spite Floyd, and not because he's guilty. Of course he's had his name dragged through the mud. There's loads of Floyd's fans saying he's on roids! Like I say, if Manny hadn't have been accused, then I think he'd have been willing to take the test. But I don't think he wants to be talked down to by Floyd, and he's sticking his heels in the mud. You've got to see things from Manny's perspective too. Floyd has publicly ridiculed him and has accused him of all sorts of things. I've seen loads of interviews with Floyd Jnr and Snr, and some of the things they've said have been shocking! I'm sure Manny was going to sue for defamation of character, so things aren't as clear as you're making them out to be.

Again, every fight is a risk, and again I respect your opinion, but in my opinion Floyd is a safety first fighter, I don't think he'd go into a 50/50 fight like what Manny would probably be.

Of course Canelo, Martinez, and Manny are beatable. Two of them have been beaten more than once. But I honestly don't think Floyd wants challenges like that. I hope he proves me wrong, because they would be fantastic fights stylistically in my opinion. If you think he'd have fought Hearns, that's fair enough, but I certainly don't think he would have.

Don't you think Manny and Floyd will ever fight then?

three years ago I'd have loved it, but now I can't say as I'm that bothered. Of course I'd watch it if it came off, but it's lost it's appeal for me now.

Thanks for the great debate, I'll have to reply tom if I can. Cheers!

Loudon.

 

Cheers mate :good I agree I definitely feel he got a couple of fights left in him.

 

So... it's about Pac vs Floyd now. :-( Go make another thread.:bbb

 

Floyd is like a guy at my work , everyday he is late and has a great excuse every morning to give, today is was the bus's fualt for being late tomorrow it was a traffic accident and it is never his fault, but the fact remains that he is always late and all the other workers make sure they are on time.

 

I don't recall De La Hoya ever really being an off the back foot boxer which is what you got to be along with tall which De La Hoya is in order to beat Mayweather. It's likely that a fight at any point in their careers could play out like their real one. In which case De La Hoya is going to be dependent on genrous judging.

 

I think the closest comparison for De La Hoya is Whitaker. Oscar's win against Pernell was controversial. Floyd takes less damage than Whitaker and has a more potent offense.

Closest comp for Mayweather is either Cotto or Judah -- Prime Oscar is better than both. But the Judah fight shows that Floyd can deal with handspeed. It's not fair to say if Judah won three rounds than a superior fighter would win more rounds, because Floyd may lose rounds until he figures you out. Once he figures you out it's over.

The Mosely fight is a perfect microcosm of a typical Mayweather fight. Floyd's opponents have a difficult time once Floyd adjusts. Mosely connected in the second round when he threw a left to the body, Floyd dropped his hands and he hit him with a right hook --

This content is protected

GIFSoup

Mosely tried the same thing in round three and Floyd slipped the body shot and hit him with a crazy three piece -- (Tried to make the gif but couldn't)

Other boxers, even great boxers, can't make those adjustments -- Against De La Hoya, Duva told Whitaker he was losing -- Whitaker thought he was doing well and his response was -- I guess I'm going to lose. In other words, I'm fighting the best way I can. Floyd doesn't have that problem. The 11th round in the Castillo fight shows that too. There is no boxer that makes in the ring or between the round adjustments better than Floyd. Because of that it's tough to count him out against any fighter.

In 40 fights he was able to disrupt his opponent's offense by hurting them with counters. Everytime they threw a punch they would get countered and hurt. They stopped throwing punches. They don't have an answer. Floyd doesn't have great one punch power but the accumulation of all the clean hard rights and left hooks adds up until the corner men are thinking about throwing in the towel. Mayweather would have been the first to stop Mosely and Marquez if those fights went 15 rounds.

In three fights, Castillo, De La Hoya and Cotto Floyd was not able to hurt his opponent with counters and slow down their output (he still landed them). He still dominated those fights and landed the cleaner more effective punches. Oscar and Cotto fought Floyd at 154, Castillo was Floyd's first fight at 135. These were Floyd's toughest fights, not because he was getting hit cleanly -- he wasn't. Not because he didn't outpoint them -- he did. Because he wasn't able to curtail his opponents offense through counters. The accumulation still builds up, he might have stopped Cotto if that fight was 15 rounds.

We know Floyd will be able to counter his opponent regardless who they are. If Floyd can hurt Oscar at 147 with his counters he dominates him. If Floyd can't hurt Oscar he can still out point him (like he did in their 154 fight). Oscar has to get to Floyd in order to win and the Whitaker fight tells me that Oscar would have a tough time doing that. I think Whitaker outlanded Oscar in that fight. The big question is can Prime Oscar hit Prime Floyd. Edge to Floyd.

http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=420217&page=2

 

and old, slow oscar hit him enough to win the first half of the fight and still take a couple rounds after that.

 

Cheers mate, been a great debate so far.

Their was wasn't a middle ground with the cut off. Bascially during the first negoiations Manny wanted a 30 day cut off, while Mayweather offered a 14 day cut off. Pacquiao didn't agree and the negotiations fell apart. Pacquiao fought Clottey and Mayweather fought Mosley. Then a couple of months after the first negotiations broke down, Mayweather said that the 14 day cut off will be off the table and that testing must be all the way up until because that is random testing, proper random testing has no cut off. Mayweather was informed from USADA that the random testing has to be all way up until the fight, for it be proper. Because having a cut off is not random testing. Now Mayweather stance is all the way up until fight. Now Pacquiao tells the Media, that he will only do a 14 day cut off. Here's problem. Mayweather says it has to be all the way up until the fight while Pacquiao says he would only do 14 days. The CEO of USADA, Travis Tygart, said Pacquiao’s 14 day cut off is pointless. He said, “If you know you aren’t going to be tested within the last 14 days, you can cheat and get away with it. It is our right to test at any time, 30 days before the fight, 20 days before, the week of, the morning of – that provides the deterrent. If you block out a period of time and say we can’t test during that period, then an athlete could cheat and get away with it.”

Now the reason Cotto couldn't have Manny tested is because the Manny steroid rumors started like a month or 2 after the Cotto/Manny signed. Cotto was already probably started camp and was already focusing on the fight. Plus Cotto was greatful for the opportunity to get a fight with and have a chance at great win since he came off the loss to Margarito and a bad performance. Marquez already had 2 fights against Manny, in which he felt he won both of them and was just desperate to get that third opportunity.

Manny could definitely be a freak a nature, Roy was a prime example of a freak of nature. I'm not accusing Pacquiao of anything, it would be wrong for me to accuse him without proof, I'm never going to discredit a guy career like that. But I can see why guys may be susciopus.

You know what, I really believe Floyd wants challenges like Manny, Alvarez, Martinez. Floyd trains like a beast, when you see a guy train as hard as Floyd you can tell he wants a challenge, thats why he putting in some work and training like a challenger. Just look at his 3 fights Mosley, Ortiz, Cotto, all 3 of those were risky and challenging fights to take. I believe he would take a 50/50 fight like you think Manny be because Floyd believes in his self, he know he great skills and he knows he put in the work and knows he can beat anybody.

I don't see fight between Floyd vs Manny happening. I don't see them coming to agreement. I actually think Arum the most to blame for his. Over the years Arum has been the one who been lying the most and making the excuses. I believe he could be one telling Pacquiao not to do the testing. Arum wants to keep the money in house, inside Top Rank. Arum was planning to give Brandon Rios a fight with Pacquiao in 2013, however with Rios pathetic performance with Richard Abril probably set it back. Pacquiao has important political stuff late 2013 therefore probably only has two fights left. So I think Arum fixed the Bradley/Pacquiao fight, so their would be rematch at some point. That way Pacquiao would be busy with Marquez and Bradley rematches and then retire and go straight in poltics. Therefore Arum would be making sure Pacquiao avoids a fight with Floyd. I truely belive Arum has been the reason it hasn't happened. Floyd and Manny are great fighter's who have fought tough opposition and had a great careers, neither of them are scared. I put the blame on Arum

 

Old slow Oscar won 3 rounds, 4 if he's your cousin. No one hits Floyd flush. Younger Oscar had trouble finding Pernell and would likewise have trouble finding Floyd. Being in his prime does not negate Floyd's defense.

 

Excellent Point

 

:huh Plenty have hit Floyd flush. And Floyd fights nothing like Pernell, a much more mobile and reflexive southpaw.