Prime Razor Ruddock vs Prime Joe Louis

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by InMemoryofJakeLamotta, Mar 13, 2018.

  1. MarkusFlorez99

    MarkusFlorez99 Active Member Full Member

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    Vitali didn't necessarily have bad defense, Lewis himself said Vitali was awkward to fight because he leaned back to avoid shots and was a smart fighter. His skin wasn't strong enough to withstand the power of Lennox Lewis. This is why despite having 3 large gashes, he was still up on the score cards. He was actually beating Lewis on points before the stoppage and somewhat held his own against Lewis's agression. He didn't get picked apart or broken down like he was getting outclassed. 3 giant cuts in a different part of the face dont just happen even in a one sided beatdown which this fight was not. He didn't have any broken bones either. His skin may not be necessarily weak but that points to the fact that his skin just wasn't durable enough to withstand a multitude of attacks from Lewis.

    Yeah your right his resume isn't good and i agree but he put up an good performance against Lewis and has a win over Corrie Sanders and Dereck Chisora while he was well past his prime. And he'd still destroy fighters like Buddy Bear, Carnera, Willard, and other early 20th century SHWs with incredible ease.

    John Ruiz also saw the left hook coming. It helps as he mentally braced for it and took it but the same with Vitalis right straight. He saw it. And Fraizer has faster feet than Tua thats why he was able to close the distance.

    We both misqouted eachother. I never said Foremans chin got better and you never said it got worse. And yes generally speaking it gets worse but we're not sure its the same for briggs as he never got dropped when he was past his prime. Ive said that his punch resistance possibly could have actually gotten better due to him adding a lot more mass and that mass absorbing the energy of the punches. He bulked up A LOT Thats just the science of it. And Mercer still landed flush a lot of times. What im saying is although he outboxed Mercer, his chin didn't decline at least noticeably anyway.

    Hide is a small heavyweight but he went in the Vitali and Bowe fight at heavyweight and when he fought Bowe he was 214, 6'2. he'd actually be a pretty normal sized one if we compare him to early 80s, 70s and 60s heavyweights. Bowe landed cleanly lots and punched him around but Vitali did it less and knocked him out bad. ABC logic ? Ok. Im just Trying to find opponents that Vitali and other relatively good punches had in common before the shoulder injury. That definitely affected his power

    Im not calling him an elite puncher. I said he was a good heavyhanded puncher in 2 previous posts
     
  2. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Ii6 Full Member

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    Roughly as skilled as Chisora.
     
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  3. MarkusFlorez99

    MarkusFlorez99 Active Member Full Member

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    I highly doubt that. Any video footage ?
     
  4. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Ii6 Full Member

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    You can find them on YT, do your work.
    I still don't get how you can defend someone as mediocre as Chisora, whose only positive attribute is his size.
     
  5. MarkusFlorez99

    MarkusFlorez99 Active Member Full Member

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    I did. Their all terrible. Chisora is mediocre but he's far more technically sound than the super heavyweights you listed. Hypothetically if you put prime chisora in a time machine and made him fight all of them he'd clap them including Carnera.

    Boxing has evolved
     
  6. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Ii6 Full Member

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    Evolution is not a progression my dear ;)
     
  7. Toney F*** U

    Toney F*** U Boxing junkie Full Member

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    In this case it is.
     
  8. DanDaly

    DanDaly Active Member Full Member

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    This is a long standing myth that I have much interest in dispelling. Harry Greb and Sugar Ray Robinson were the best fighters in the world p4p when they were prime and they would be today. Mike Gibbons, Tommy Gibbons, Tommy Loughran(lhw), Gene Tunney(lhw), Benny Leonard, Jake Lamotta, Freddie Steele, Hank Armstrong, and many others would dominate their respective divisions had they been active today. Only when heavyweights are discussed does this absolutely absurd suggestion, that boxing has evolved light years and fighters in those days wouldn't be competitive today, come up.
     
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  9. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    By “evolve” they mean access to steroids. Shws would still be second raters if not for the “evolution” of boxing.
     
  10. DanDaly

    DanDaly Active Member Full Member

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    With the introduction of steroids into the sport there is absolutely no reason that shws come into the ring in anything less than top condition. They should be able to go 15 rounds easy because steroids allow you to train harder and more frequently because they make recovery exceptionally easy. Even with more muscle mass.
     
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  11. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Ii6 Full Member

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    Yet some of the most skilled and best fighters ever fought 100 years ago.
     
  12. janitor

    janitor Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Then perhaps Jess Willard deserves more respect?

    I am guessing that he didn't have access to steroids.
     
  13. DanDaly

    DanDaly Active Member Full Member

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    What do you mean? For coming into the ring out of shape at times? Honestly there aren’t many super heavyweights I rate very highly. Ironically enough with access to all kinds of resources to make them better at their sport they have managed to get worse.
     
  14. janitor

    janitor Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Well you obviously can't fault his stamina, and he didn't have access to steroids, unless they were invented much earlier than I think!
     
  15. DanDaly

    DanDaly Active Member Full Member

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    I’m not sure I follow what you’re saying. Anytime Jess Willard, or any fighter for that matter, doesn’t come into the ring in shape I blame them 100%. What I was getting at is that fighters today in the heavyweight division, who are super-heavyweights, have no excuse for not being in shape if they’re on steroids.