Prime Razor Ruddock vs Prime Joe Louis

Roughly as skilled as Chisora.

 

I highly doubt that. Any video footage ?

 

You can find them on YT, do your work.
I still don't get how you can defend someone as mediocre as Chisora, whose only positive attribute is his size.

 

I did. Their all terrible. Chisora is mediocre but he's far more technically sound than the super heavyweights you listed. Hypothetically if you put prime chisora in a time machine and made him fight all of them he'd clap them including Carnera.

Boxing has evolved

 

Evolution is not a progression my dear

 

In this case it is.

 

This is a long standing myth that I have much interest in dispelling. Harry Greb and Sugar Ray Robinson were the best fighters in the world p4p when they were prime and they would be today. Mike Gibbons, Tommy Gibbons, Tommy Loughran(lhw), Gene Tunney(lhw), Benny Leonard, Jake Lamotta, Freddie Steele, Hank Armstrong, and many others would dominate their respective divisions had they been active today. Only when heavyweights are discussed does this absolutely absurd suggestion, that boxing has evolved light years and fighters in those days wouldn't be competitive today, come up.

 

By “evolve” they mean access to steroids. Shws would still be second raters if not for the “evolution” of boxing.

 

With the introduction of steroids into the sport there is absolutely no reason that shws come into the ring in anything less than top condition. They should be able to go 15 rounds easy because steroids allow you to train harder and more frequently because they make recovery exceptionally easy. Even with more muscle mass.

 

Yet some of the most skilled and best fighters ever fought 100 years ago.

 

Then perhaps Jess Willard deserves more respect?

I am guessing that he didn't have access to steroids.

 

What do you mean? For coming into the ring out of shape at times? Honestly there aren’t many super heavyweights I rate very highly. Ironically enough with access to all kinds of resources to make them better at their sport they have managed to get worse.

 

Well you obviously can't fault his stamina, and he didn't have access to steroids, unless they were invented much earlier than I think!

 

I’m not sure I follow what you’re saying. Anytime Jess Willard, or any fighter for that matter, doesn’t come into the ring in shape I blame them 100%. What I was getting at is that fighters today in the heavyweight division, who are super-heavyweights, have no excuse for not being in shape if they’re on steroids.

 

Someone like Sugar Ray Robinson has the style that would easily translate into modern boxing and he would probably dominate. I agree to an extent that top boxers from 1940ish onwards would still be able to compete with relatively modern top boxers of their weightclass as we see with Pep and SRR but analyzing all the video footage of MWs and LHW guys that you listed belonging in the 1910s and 20s its clear footwork has improved, slickness of world class fighters as well and just the basic fundamentals have changed and have arguably progressed. Top fighters then were tougher with more grit though no denying.

Charley Burley was a 30s-40s skilled boxer so we'll use him as an example. He had great ring iq and was a master of defense and distance manipulation with feints for his time, but compared to boxers such as Canelo, or Toney, or Hopkins, or Whitaker, or Mayweather he looks absolutely rudimentary and wouldn't be as efficient in today's era. Not even sure he'd be world class. Generally speaking top boxers now are far more efficient at moving in and out of range with quick feet, shoulder slipping, ducking, dodging, and rolling with punches and countering than they were in the early 20th century. Technique has gradually gotten sharper

The gap in skill and technique between top SHWs from the 90s and now against SHWs from the early 1900s is the true monster. Jesse Willard and Primo Carnera or Buddy Bear would get obliterated by 70s onward SHWs like Lennox Lewis or Andy Ruiz or Riddick Bowe or Wladimir Klitschko or George Foreman or even Gerry Cooney in seconds within the first round. Big heavyweights have gotten more technically sound and If it's not obvious why then what to tell you. But look if you want to have a civil debate on this please message me or something. I dont feel replying on this thread anymore. Whether people are agreeing or disagreeing with me