Prime Razor Ruddock vs Prime Joe Louis

Holyfield surely didn't fight like he was an inexperienced professional. In reality, he'd been boxing a lot longer than Marciano had when he fought Walcott.

 

Because he wasn't as good as all of them.

 

He could, but I'm not sure if he would. I wouldn't bet on it, that's for sure.

 

It was his twelfth pro fight, he was just 23 and CW. I think he was hardly prime.

 

Actually i could see it happening. Usyk is about 215lb 6'3 and extremely technically sound, Quick hands and high ring iq and his footwork is amazing. Everyone on that list are sub 200lb and wouldn't make heavyweight today. However Joe Joyce could have trouble with Walcott.

 

I think I'd bet on him to beat Sharkey. I'd have to see how he is at the weigh in, because if he's in the shape he was for Leon Spinks or Holyfield I, I think he's easily capable of one-upping Walker (I know Walker was fairly lucky to get the draw, but even getting that close is not a good sign vs Qawi).

 

Twelve pro fight or not, he'd have 174 amateur fights and he was already in title contention. There's no way of painting him as inexperienced. You think he only started learning when he turned pro? Of course he didn't. I don't know what him being at crusierweight has to do with it. I think most would agree that Holyfield peaked as a CW.

 

Either way, Qawi definitely wouldn't be a dominant HW champion in the 1930s.

 

Oh for sure. Definitely not to the degree of a Louis. But ruling him out against the champs of the 30/40s is a bit of a stretch IMO. I'd definitely give him good odds vs Baer, Walcott, Carnera and Sharkey. He matches up well with Charles and Schmeling (so long as his chin holds up) as well, though I wouldn't give him good odds there.

 

Okay, that`s your opinion. I think his prime was early 90s as HW.

 

I think he could beat Walcott and Sharkey, as they seemed to struggle without speed advantage. Carnera is tough, I think Primo could win a close, ugly decision full of grabbing and showing. Baer seems to be bad matchup for him, I'm afraid he'd stop him in brutal fashion (though you'll never know with Maxie).

 

Louis KO's Razor inside of 8 IMO

 

Usyk is not a power puncher and he himself is a sub 200 pounder who made cruiserweight in his 30's no problem without killing himself to cut. He isn't going to be "running through" skilled technicians like Walcott or Charles or Schmeling.

Joe Joyce coudn't knock out an obese washed up 40 year old Stiverne who had previously gotten KO'd in 1 round. As far as I can tell, he's feather fisted. We haven't seen nearly enough for him to think he can beat those guys. His best win, Dubois, was an untested rookie who basically quit. Joyce hasn't really beaten anyone honestly.

 

Thats Usyk at Cruiserweight. Usyk at heavyweight was about 215-217lb and still maintained an amazing gas tank and quick hands and showed wonderful head movement and mobile foot work. Thats my point. Heavyweights then are small cruiserweights now. Joe Joyce is 6'6 250lb+ and he in not featherfisted. A featherfisted person doesn't breaks person's eye socket with his jab

realistically speaking Heavyweights ever since the 90s average out at 6'4 230lb+. They're so much bigger, stronger and likely hit harder on average with better chins on average due to they're size. And heavyweight boxing has also evolved since the earlyish 1900s. Although boxing has stayed consistent since the 40s

 

Markus my point was that Usky was done growing if he was 30 at cruiserweight. Adding 10 lbs isn't going to make him "dwarf" Walcott and Charles who were only 2-3 inches shorter and maybe 5-10 lbs lighter than Usyk's best opponents. Nor would adding 10 lbs suddenly mean he could effortlessly outmuscle them and overpower them.

Joyce has had 12 fights. TWELVE for crying out loud. He is completely unproven. I wouldn't care if he was 7 ft tall and 300 lbs. We haven't seen enough to favor him over 3 boxers who are easily top 30-50 in the division's history. If the best example you have to prove he is a power puncher is breaking an eye socket than that's not much of an argument. Let me know when he has knocked out a fighter top 10, not a corner retirement.

Size doesn't always mean you are more durable. Dempsey KO'd Fulton in 1 and he was 6'6 with an 84' reach and had 9 KO losses overall. Many boxers today are not carrying functional weight and strength, they are simply obese or muscle bound behemoths and are lucky that fights are 12 rounds and fought at a much slower pace against other overweight slow opponents. Big men peaked in the 90's and then started slowly declining rapiidly after Wladmir started getting old in the 2010's. This is a very weak era that is barely hanging by a thread due to fighters like Fury and Joshua.