I gr0w tired of hearing all the sore RJJ fans yelling "if this had happend years ago!" Point is it didnt and RJJ is only 3 years older than JC. JC gets criticized for his "slapping" and leaving himself open, but he knows how to adapt to his opponents and knows how to win fights, even if it is ugly. He fought Hokpins to a victory, even if it was a draw, he was the busier fighter and beat a man who possess as good a boxing intellect as any ATG. RJJ fought and won by his speed. Even if he was prime, he still faces the situation of trying to adapt to Calzaghe style. I cannot imagine him doing better when he was younger at somehow "figuring out" Joes style. Fighters usually get more adaptable as they get older and more experienced. The trick is then to apply to their skills. RJJ relied on "speed kills". No more. He was never and has never been a "boxer". He relied on his hand, foot, reflexes to beat his opponents. And when his legs were gone he became nothing more than fighter with very fast hands that. He never did box, even in his Prime. If RJJ had shown signs in even a few of the rounds that he was able to get the better of Calzaghe but lets say didnt have the energy, I wouldnt be making this point, but RJJ didnt. He got outclassed and I honestly thought he looked confused at times, as if he simply didnt know what to do. Much as Kessler did in the later rounds (not comparing RJJ to Kesseler) but Kesseler also had a look upon his face of "I seriously dont know how how to be effective against this guy". There wasnt anything RJJ had that he thought would work against JC. So what happens when he is younger with less fights and is more cocky? He just dodges EVERYTHING Calzaghe throws? He dances out of the way and potshots? And JC just stands there and gets hit? Calzaghe is a boxer, he knows how to change his strategy to beat an opponent and has done it times before. Even if he loses against Prime RJJ, he would find something, be it countering and timing, having to force him to mix it up, being more defensively oriented, but he would make it a competitive fight. RJJ TKO 6! is simply irrational. Based on what? JC having a bad chin? The man got knocked down and came back roaring after all of his knockdowns, including this one. RJJ didnt even seriously hurt him, and had he lunged in JC would have likely gone toe to toe with him trading shots. You really want to argue that RJJ's chin is gonna outlast JC's in a slugfest? Unlikely. Its a competitive fight and a 60/40 one at best for RJJ. Likely it would be the most even and competitive fight of his career had it happened. You all may attack now and rip everything to shreds in your claim of RJJ's demigod status
agreed. Roy admitting he couldn't figure out Joe has nothing to do with diminished skills. Figuring out a fighter is a mental thing and Roy at any stage would have trouble with Calzaghe. Roy's confusion would lead to a lessened work rate thusly allowing Calzaghe to win rounds. Calzaghe has a quality beard, and even though he was caught a bit cold chinned in his last 2 fights it doesn't change that.
Nope. If old Roy can put Calzaghe on his ass in the 1st round and make the fight somewhat competitive for the first 5 rounds. A prime Roy, with young legs, quick reflexes and dominant speed would have possibly stopped Calzaghe or widely decisioned him.
I stopped reading right there. If you can't imagine a PRIME RJ doing any better than tonight, you are an >>>>>>>>>.:good
Outstanding post, MexicanJew. I'd even go a step further and say 60/40 Calzaghe. Calzaghe's style would have always troubled Roy.
MexicanJew made a very fair and balaned post. Sure, I can imagine Roy doing better, but he would always be troubled by someone like Calzaghe.
RJJ would not do any better in terms of being able to decipher Calzaghes style. That was my point. If he could not do it now to any degree he could not do it then. It has nothing to do with his physical abilities, but his mental aptitude. Joe has him beat in that area. I did not make myself clear on that point. The PRime would be more competitive due to RJJ's athletic ability. Not his boxing ability.
But natural talent is what made RJ so special. You can't just ignore that FACT. In his prime, his raw talents were off the charts. It would've been a completely different fight. You can't look at tonight and say, "Oh, based on what i saw tonight, i conclude that Calzaghe would've given a prime RJ trouble." I think Calzaghe's great natural talents would've presented some puzzles but i think in the end, RJ wide UD.
Bottom line is that Roy said he couldn't decipher what Joe was doing in the ring. Completely a mental part of boxing. Has Roy gone ******ed since his prime? To say Roy wipes the floor with Joe is ludicrous. Is a prime Roy going to throw punches despite the fact that he wouldn't be able to figure out what Joe was doing? That would create a potentially disastrous situation for a fighter. Throwing punches in bunches when you are confused from a solely strategical situation is how fighters get caught.
All of you people saying Calzaghe would pose problems are only looking at it from Calzaghe's offensive point of view. But what about the problems RJ would've presented to Calzaghe? Tonight, JC was fighting a stationary fighter with shot reflexes. Prime RJ is a bunny hoping around the ring with cat like reflexes to not only exploit openings offensively but avoid punches. Let's not forget that. His reflexes and foot speed made him very hard to hit. Would a prime RJ just stand there and let JC stand in front of him with his hands down? Yeah right.
RJJ close UD. Raw talent is raw talent, but RJJ would be facing for the first in his career a fighter with speed to match his and with similar reflexes. In terms of overall athleticism he has JC beat, but he you cannot simply say he destroys him or easily beats him. RJJ never fought any comparable to Calzaghe to make such a comparison. And yes JC never fought anyone like RJJ, but he sure has hell has had better longevity into his career, something RJJ has not, and has demonstrated the fortitude to apply and modify a strategy as needed. RJJ has not. JC applys his natural abilities using an actual stratagem. RJJ simply used them as he had them with no real comprehensive application and when they began to diminish he was left with nothing. All he has left now is quick hands.
Agree to disagree. Whatever JC could do, RJ could do better in his prime. If JC chose to fight on the outside, he would've lost. If JC wanted to get brave and initiate the action, he would've gotten hurt and probably KTFO.