Prime RJJ vs Tonight's Kovalev

It would be a war , Roys reflexes and hand speed would give Kovalev hell .

On the flipside , Roy does not possesse the same cast iron chin and defense that Bernard has been blessed with .

Kovalev is bound to land no matter how fast Roy is .

How does he respond to a flush powerpunch from Kovalev ?

Toss up fight .

But if you put a gun to my head , I would pick a battered Roy to win on points.

 

You're obviously not looking from Roy's perspective at all.

Because if you were, you'd see that apart from a lot of money, Roy had nothing to gain by rematching Hopkins.

Yes, Hopkins had improved as a fighter. But so had Roy from their first fight. Roy beat him with a fractured hand back in 93.

Fast forward to 2002, and Roy was two divisions higher.

Fighting Ruiz to a win a version of the HW title, surpassed fighting Hopkins again.


It's not about what you think.

It's about what he thought.

Whether you rate Ruiz or not, Roy made history that night.

Roy had no motivation to drop weight, to fight a guy he'd already beaten.

Everyone has different circumstances surrounding them.

Hopkins didn't want to fight Joe Calzaghe back then. Calzaghe didn't want to fight Froch. It appears that Froch doesn't want to fight Degale.

Roy not wanting to fight Hopkins in 2002, doesn't constitute as a duck.

He fought him in 93, and then he fought him again in 2010.

So you're way off the mark.


Has it ever occurred to you, that if Hopkins had've been willing to fight at LHW, and he hadn't insulted Roy straight away in the interview, and he'd have been more respectful, the fight could have been made?

Both fighters have huge egos. As hilarious as the interview was, your never going to negotiate with a guy, when you say "It looks like Roy's been eating the dog food that he feeds his pit bulls"

From that point onwards, any respect or a potential talk of a deal, went straight out of the window.

You can't rile someone like that, and then accuse them of not wanting the fight.

It was ridiculous.

Bernard knew what he was doing.

They appeared on a HBO show together a little earlier, and they were both sat next to each other and showed each other a lot of respect.

IMHO, Bernard never wanted the fight, and he just put on a show to make it look as though he did.

 

The funny thing is I think you might be right but using Frazier as the example why is ridiculous and really undermines your credibility on this matter.

 

I beg to differ. I am the voice of reason on this message board. It's a heavy cross to bear, though.

While it can be argued that Bernard Hopkins could have been more prepared to do amendments, he still did more than Roy Jones Jr.

But I do. Jones Jr went on to fight John Ruiz because it was safer and more rewarding career move. I couldn't empathize with that more than I do.

All boxers fights with injuries, no point in giving extra credits to those who whine about it. Jones Jr had gained some experience, but as he was fighter dependent on athletic talent he had not grown like the technician and genious of hard work Bernard Hopkins.

Fighting Ruiz was, from Jones Jrs standpoint, a cherrypick. Ruiz was a tough journyman, no more no less, who had managed to get his hands on a strap, and Jones Jr asssumed his speed and reflexes would keep him out of harms way. There were better boxers around who could have matched Jones Jr better in skill and cunning.

Calzaghe ducked Froch, I'm unclear about the circumstances with Hopkins and Calzaghe, Froch had proved what he needed to prove by Ha-ha knocking out George Groves.

Jones Jr and Hopkins fighting 2010 was a show, not a fight.

My impression was that Jones Jr tried to **** Hopkins off, not the other way around.

:think

 

the answer is simple

It wouldn't have happened cause RJJ didn't fight fighters in their prime when he was in his prime

If it happened I'd go with RJJ,

Kov has only beaten a well past his prime Hopkins who only threw 15 punches per round... The jury is still out IMO

Yes Hopkins was gratuitous in defeat praising Kov but what else could he say? Hopkins at this stage has no place in a ring and it only really showed when he fought a good fighter when he was on form, no diff from when he fought Dawson and suddenly Dawson was flavour of the month

 

Kovalev would annihilate kid coma
[YT]7yDS1tic0dc[/YT]

 

This is out of fkng control. RJJ wins. Kova has yet to fight an able true champion not a 50 year old.

 

What are you talking about?

When Roy stepped up to fight Toney in 94, he was classed as one of the best fighters in the world.

Roy didn't just win 'some' fights at LHW.

And his prime wasn't while he was at 160.

 

AnotherFan,

This is getting silly now, and I'm just repeating myself.


What do you mean Roy knew how good Hopkins was at that point?

Hopkins had beaten Tito in a high profile fight, which IMHO, was a great win.

But other than that, he hadn't done much back then.

What don't you understand about the fact that Roy had already beaten him whilst injured, and he was TWO divisions above him?

Tell me what Hopkins brought to the table?

What would Roy's goal have been?

To have beaten him again?

Why?


It's easy to look back now and see things differently.

Because we know that Hopkins had great wins after 2002.

But try and cast your mind back, and think as though it's 2002.

Let's say Roy had fought and beaten him.

Do you think he'd have gotten credit for beating a 37 year old MW who he'd already beaten?

Think about it.


Ruiz was a MUCH bigger fight, as was Tarver, to Roy.

Winning a version of the HW title at 34, after once fighting at 154, made history.

Also, he didn't target the weakest holder, and even if he had've done, so what?

It was still a hell of an achievement at 34, after 50 fights.

There wasn't any other LHW's queuing up to fight Ruiz.

No. I'm saying it was a much BIGGER fight.


Hopkins - A 37 year old MW, who Roy had already beaten.

Ruiz - A 226 pound HW, and the WBA champion, that brought a guaranteed purse of $15m, and the chance to make history.


Yet you think he should have rematched Hopkins instead?

How??

Roy held a win over him, and was considered the best fighter on the planet.

You've posted up the edited version of the interview from Sky Sports.

You need to watch the HBO version.


Here it is:

http://youtu.be/UJbOw_5DPiE


Hopkins was the FIRST guy to talk.

Look what he said about Roy.

What did you expect Roy to say?

It was Hopkins who pissed Roy off.

It was genius if he had no intentions of making a fight, but wanted to appear like he did.

If that was the case, which I think it was, then he was quite clever.

But it wasn't genius if he genuinely wanted the fight.

If he'd have genuinely wanted the fight, he wouldn't immediately have insulted Roy and then demanded 50/50.

Roy didn't need to fight Hopkins again.


Did you read what I typed earlier?

On Saturday night, Steve Bunce told the BoxNation audience, that Hopkins had told him in 2010, that his defeat to Roy was on his mind every day.

It wasn't a coincidence that Hopkins acted like he did in 2002, only to make a fight with Roy in 2010 when he was a shot fighter.

Roy didn't make any money that night.

The fight bombed on PPV.

I'd have to look into it again, because it was almost 5 years ago, but the reports after the fight, were that because Roy had certain stipulations in the contract, and the viewing figures were so poor, he made next to nothing.

The fight was a complete farce.

Nobody wanted to see the fight.

It was Hopkins who pushed and pushed for it, because his ego had to settle the score at any cost.

Now what top fighter would have gone out of his way to fight that version of Roy, who was a million miles past his best?


Read this below:

(I can't post the link, but simply type it into a search engine to read it in it's entirety)

It's from 2010, but it quotes what Hopkins said in 2008.

Hopkins-Jones II: Better Never Than Late - SecondsOut.com
www.secondsout.com › Home › Columns › Thomas Hauser
Three days later, Hopkins declared, “I don't want to fight Roy; not after ... The things that he was able to do because he was Superman; he can't do them .... Roy knows how to beat Bernard, but his body can no longer do what has to be done.

 

http://youtu.be/UJbOw_5DPiE

 

He was clearly never the same after dropping back.

Tarver would always have caused Roy trouble, and given him something to think about.

But Roy beat him fair and square in 2003, even though he was exhausted and was running on fumes for the last three rounds.

If Roy could beat him in that condition, there's no reason to think that he couldn't have beaten him if he was younger and fresher.

I think he'd have been dealt with if he hadn't have lost the eliminator to Harding.

If he'd have beaten Harding, Roy would have fought him in 2000.

Who knows how Roy's career would have unfolded if that had happened?

It always makes me wonder.

He should never have rushed back to LHW like he did at almost 35.

 

Great post!

I agree entirely with everything you've said.

I don't know what you think, but I don't think Bernard will retire just yet.


:good

 

This is a good post.

But if Roy could have tagged Kov early with some power, to have gained his respect, would that have made Kov cautious?

If only these questions could be answered.

Get Marty McFly on the phone.

 

Hi mate,

It was just a joke.

I thought you knew that?

I was just trolling Rico, who's a passionate Roy hater.


I also didn't mean any disrespect to Rick Frazier.

Any fighter, whether they're amateur or pro, deserve an enormous amount of respect.


:good

 

AnotherFan,

Someone needs to be.

Roy didn't need to do anything.

After the Kelly fight (where the interview took place) he only made one more mandatory defence (Woods) before going to HW.

I don't think Roy was bothered about a rematch, unless he got loads of money.

But my only argument here, is that it didn't constitute as a duck.

If Hopkins was so desperate to avenge the loss, the onus was on him to make the fight.

But again, he did nothing.

You might not rate Ruiz, but it wasn't safer.

Hopkins was a MW without much power.

Ruiz was a 226 pound HW, who'd knocked Evander down.

You can't rewrite history.

I agree.

But I'm looking from Roy's perspective.

You've seen the interview.

I've been a fan of Roy's for many a year and have seen numerous links, videos and other interviews etc.

He didn't see Hopkins as a completely different fighter.

I've heard him say that.

Roy's got a huge ego, and he thinks that the only reason Hopkins made all of those MW defences, is because he left the division, and relinquished the IBF belt that he'd won to move up to SMW.

I've heard Roy say that a few times. He genuinely thought/thinks that he allowed Hopkins to have the success he had.

So in Roy's mind, beating Hopkins whilst been 100%, was no problem at all, seeing as though he'd beaten him with a fractured hand.

It was an opportunity to make history.

You're only looking from your own perspective instead of looking from Roy's.

We know that Hopkins was a better fighter than Ruiz.

But from Roy's perspective, Hopkins was - 'I've been there, and I've done that'

Again, he had nothing to gain by fighting him again.

Roy was the first fighter in 106 years to win a HW title, after also winning a MW title.

I listed those guys from the top of my head, just to highlight the fact that every fighter has a different set of circumstances surrounding them, and everyone has different goals.

Look at Calzaghe fighting Roy.

He could have fought Pavlik instead.

He'd have gotten much more credit beating Pavlik.

But he wanted to fight Roy instead.

IMHO, he would have beaten Pavlik easier than Bernard did.

It was a complete embarrassment from start to finish.

I can only assume that Hopkins begged Oscar to promote the fight, because Hopkins has a stake in GBP.

Maybe you'll change your mind if you look at the extended interview that I've posted.