Primo Carnera & Jess Willard in comparison to AJ's opposition so far

I would say both are considerably better then “Tomato can “. Where on the spectrum idk? I can see Primo winning against fat Ruiz...in shape one no but the fat one definitely. Primo would be one of AJs toughest fights but he lacks the chin to be champ of most eras.

 

This is often referred to as WIllard's best filmed performance. It's against a guy who would be a .500 fighter for the remainder of his career. Can you point out where you see the evidence of athleticism here?

This content is protected

 

Moran was .500 fighter for the rest of his career? Did he improve after this one? I've never seen a fighter he could beat. Willard is the same uncoordinated, stiff, unskilled man that we've seen in the Dempsey and Johnson fights. There is absolutely NOTHING "athletic" about Willard. There must not have been enough money in boxing at that time to interest the athletes.

 

I take it we are talking about Carnera and Willard in their prime vs the Wlad ( age 41 ) and Povetkin ( age 39 ) that AJ fought?

I'd pick Wlad and Povetkin to go 2-0. Parker is 50.50. He simply lacks aggression, and would be giving up size and reach.

Carnera wasn't a stiff. For a big guy he moved well and had 15+ round stamina. While he didn't have a good chin, his heart was as Willard should be viewed as excellent. Look at the beating Dempsey and Baer gave these two, neither gave up.

Joshua to me is the best today, but his legacy is still up in the air. What's know is he doesn't do well vs swarming attackers. Ruiz jr, and Povetkin showed us that. AJ lacks a dominant jab, and is just okay in the chin department. Still wise he's much better than Wilder, and he hits twice are hard as Fury. AJ is the #1 guy for this era of heavyweight boxing, I think.

 

Willard did better vs. Moran than Johnson did in my opinion. No, Moran wasn't very good. If there were rankings in his time, he's be outside the top ten, perhaps a reason why Johnson picked him for a title fight and Willard followed suit.

Willard hurt his standing by not fighting in 1917 and 1918. A match with Dillion, Fulton, Miske, or Meehan probably could have happened.

 

What other super heavyweight in history, has shown genuine 20 round stamina?

I will wait!

 

There I would have to disagree.

Moran was absolutely seen as a legitimate contender, when Willard fought him.

Perhaps one of the top three available contenders.

He still hadn't quite established himself when Johnson fought him.

 

Impossible to answer as the last 20 round fight at heavyweight was in the early 1940's. I think Lewis, Wlad and Vitali could go 15 rounds, and slow their pace to make 20 if they needed too.

 

Not on the level of Willard by any means, but I've always been very impressed by Bowe's stamina.

Willard has very good conditioning, but not a high workrate, Johnson's style didn't allow that.

 

Lower the output, stand around and pose against an old, disinterested fighter and Andy Ruiz would show genuine 20 round stamina.

 

I half agree. He didn't earn the shot vs Johnson at all. He lost to McCarty, and Smith...those two were contenders. He was beaten by Gayer, and Kennedy who was a known 2-2 fighter. He also lost to fat man Ross, and a very limited and stiff Al Kaufman, two guys who Johnson gave title shots too.

Prior to that he was Ko'd three times. I fail to see one big win on his resume, only losses to the best he fought, and losses to some guys a top contender shouldn't loose to.

Post Johnson he beat Wells and Coffey, probably his biggest wins to date, but was that enough to be viewed as legit contender? Willard could have fought 4-8 guys who were better. It was a passable 1st title defense for Willard, nothing beyond that.

 

No he wouldn't.

He would still have to move around, and hold his hands up.

He would still have to throw punches and concentrate.

A marathon is ran at a slower pace than a 10k, but it still takes more out of you!

 

Moran was pretty highly regarded going into the Willard figth.

The fight that people really anted to see, was Willard Fulton.

Outside of that the talk was about Moran, Morris, Levinsky and Dillon!

 

You are not doing your position any favors there. This is essentially an era to era match-up. You are just illustrating how poor that era was.