Primo Carnera vs the contenders

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by janitor, May 14, 2017.


  1. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

    27,674
    7,654
    Dec 31, 2009
    NB "World class"

    at any particular time one guy in the top ten might maintain a ranking even though he is no longer strictly world class or losing too much To truly be considered "world class". in 1961 miteff was that man. Technically he was rated though and that's why I differentiate between "world class" and "rated" in my description in opponents Williams stopped.

    Against Williams, miteff was 1-3 in his last four having lost to the ranked chuvalo, Cooper and machen within twelve months so it is little wonder Alex maintained a ranking with one slender win sandwiched between those beatings over unranked Alonzo Johnson who was experiencing patchy form himself. However, contenders fought each other back then so maybe that's how was able to maintain this threadbare status?

    Billy the Barber Daniels was a better win for Williams. Even so Supposedly Billy closed his barber shop at 6pm and was in the ring for ten competitive rounds both times against the big cat.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
  2. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

    97,728
    29,078
    Jun 2, 2006
    If you accept your premise then Young Jack Johnson,Agramonte,,Holman,Richardson,Rischer were all rated at one time or another.
     
  3. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

    27,674
    7,654
    Dec 31, 2009
    Unfortunately Carnera did beat guys with current world class status. To be fair, Williams also met guys with current world class status and rankings, but he lost those fights. Apart from the close points wins over a moon lighting barber.
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
  4. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

    71,579
    27,231
    Feb 15, 2006
    It is very easy to pick lots of people over Carnera head to head when you know that your prediction can never be tested.

    Based on what happened in teh real physical universe, he should be a strong favourite over somebody like Williams, and a favourite over a lot of other champions.
     
    reznick and choklab like this.
  5. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

    97,728
    29,078
    Jun 2, 2006
    I pick what my honest opinion dictates.
    Carnera could not cope with punchers.
     
  6. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

    71,579
    27,231
    Feb 15, 2006
    He couldn't cope with Baer or Louis.

    He beat plenty of punchers.
     
    reznick likes this.
  7. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

    97,728
    29,078
    Jun 2, 2006
    Who? I think the Godfrey fight was a tank job.
     
  8. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

    71,579
    27,231
    Feb 15, 2006
    That is not proven.

    That aside guys like Hamas, Lekinsky, and Neusel were punchers.

    Not great punchers, but world class fighters who relied on power.
     
  9. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

    15,903
    7,636
    Mar 17, 2010
    Gastanaga, described to have destructive power.
    Primo fought him after Louis's management backed out.
    Primo TKO'd him in 5.
    He was favored 2 to 1, for having a "tremendous edge in boxing ability."

    http://imgur.com/a/UriuT
     
    Last edited: May 15, 2017
    choklab likes this.
  10. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

    52,823
    44,495
    Apr 27, 2005
    Their whole careers aren't based on one fight. What a load. Continue to vastly overstate it tho.

    Resume doesn't guaranteee anything H2H as proven by fights like Foremans decimation of Frazier.
     
  11. The Long Count

    The Long Count Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    15,428
    8,874
    Oct 8, 2013
    Which is why I cringe when I see him on top 20 lists. Does anyone get more from a shorter Prime while missing most of the contenders then this guy.
     
  12. The Long Count

    The Long Count Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

    15,428
    8,874
    Oct 8, 2013

    I don't believe he ever fought Hamas.
    As for the list of names a list can be misread taken out of context. schaaf was a dead man walking.
    Carnera was a below average champion. At the same time he's been over criticized for decades by a malignant press who disliked him either for his ethnicity or size. His name doesn't deserve to be synonymous with a fraudulent champion. He showed more guts then many champions that followed. His resume and volume of fights is solid.
     
    reznick likes this.
  13. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 VIP Member

    52,823
    44,495
    Apr 27, 2005

    And this is it. Carnera deserves recognition for a solid career and plenty of good moments, consistency and longevity in his era. You've also fairly summed him up fairly ability wise as well. Not many are finding this balance.
     
    The Long Count likes this.
  14. Perry

    Perry Boxing Junkie Full Member

    9,343
    1,536
    Apr 26, 2015
    My father back in the early 30's visited the training camps of Loughran, Schmeling, Latzo and Isadora Gastanaga. My father told me Gastanaga was a huge puncher who would fight in a crouch bringing uppercuts from the canvas to his sparring partners chin knocking them out.
     
    reznick likes this.
  15. reznick

    reznick In the 7.2% Full Member

    15,903
    7,636
    Mar 17, 2010
    Amazing!