'Professor' Mike Donovan sparring Billy Edwards, 1905

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Melankomas, May 29, 2023.


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  1. Journeyman92

    Journeyman92 Bob N Weave Full Member

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    John L Sullivan had he aged better might’ve at least had an exhibition for us to watch, it makes me just a touch sad but I’m grateful for the mythos he left behind by not being seen by any eyes today. He is my favourite boxer sometimes because he’s more a folk hero than a man.
     
    Journeyman92, May 30, 2023
    Journeyman92, May 30, 2023
    #16
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  2. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    What's the provenance on this? How do we know who's supposed to be in it? Who made it?
     
    cross_trainer, May 30, 2023
    cross_trainer, May 30, 2023
    #17
  3. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Edison wanted Sullivan instead of Peter Courtney for the kinetograph fight. I don't remember why it fell through. But you're probably right that it's for the best.

    EDIT: From a historical standpoint, Donovan and Edwards are better, if that's who these guys are, since they left manuals behind that we can compare and contrast to the footage. They taught this stuff, and were lighter weight guys known for having a level of skill.
     
    cross_trainer, May 30, 2023
    cross_trainer, May 30, 2023
    #18
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  4. Melankomas

    Melankomas Prime Jeffries would demolish a grizzly in 2 Full Member

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    Sullivan had countless exhibitions until like 1905, I'm sure at least one was filmed
     
    Melankomas, May 30, 2023
    Melankomas, May 30, 2023
    #19
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  5. Melankomas

    Melankomas Prime Jeffries would demolish a grizzly in 2 Full Member

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    Footage like this gives me faith in the technique of pre-1900s boxers. Both of these men make very good showings for themselves in the two videos, and they look more modernistic and refined than Fitz, Corbett, Jeffries or Johnson do. It's weird, since Donovan and Edwards were from the 1860s and 70s.

    Btw, I was able to verify that it is indeed Donovan and Edwards in the footage. Donovan looks identical to how he did in real life as an old man, and a friend of mine who's an expert on the era told me it's Edwards.
     
    Melankomas, May 30, 2023
    Melankomas, May 30, 2023
    #20
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  6. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT Full Member

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    IIRC, I believe Sullivan rejected the payment on offer and/or priced himself out. I think he was offered a decent amount but perhaps John L was overly "plump" as at that time - so 1) not in viable condition and not so aesthetically pleasing to appear on film. I also recall reading that Courtney doctored his record to make it look more impressive and therefore eligible to share the ring with Corbett. As to Billy Edwards, the guy on film does resemble still photos of the actual man.
     
    Pugguy, May 31, 2023
    Pugguy, May 31, 2023
    #21
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  7. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    :hang:ohno:rolleyes:


    If he was one of the finest tacticians in boxing, then the rest were awful.

    Head straight up. Chin up. Back arched. No head movement. No guard. Hands at his waist. He looks and fights awful. Basically the same age as Mike Tyson is now. (And he's had a hard life.)

    There's no harm in respecting the pioneers of the sport, but times have changed.

    Here is "The Professor" in blue if he fought a novice boxer today in a current boxer's pro debut.


    This content is protected
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2023
    Dubblechin, May 31, 2023
    Dubblechin, May 31, 2023
    #22
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  8. Melankomas

    Melankomas Prime Jeffries would demolish a grizzly in 2 Full Member

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    You can't compare 58 in 2023 to 58 in 1905, it's just not fair. Plus, Mike has the help of good ol' roids to keep him in shape.

    Also I think it's unfair to say that Donovan didn't employ head movement or a guard. He feints with his head quite a bit throughout the clip, like at 0:17, 0:37, 0:50, 1:40 and 2:38. It's not excessive, and he gets hit quite a bit, but give the guy some credit he's old asf. Did you see how he collapsed in between rounds? This clearly isn't a man in the prime of his life. Even in spite of that, Donovan still makes up for this handicap and parries most of the punches coming his way.

    I don't think anyone's picking the 58 year old Donovan against Muhammad Ali
     
    Melankomas, May 31, 2023
    Melankomas, May 31, 2023
    #23
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  9. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    Your video depicts an untrained man. Mike Donovan in his prime versus a random untrained man ends with the latter unconscious.

    That said, the video was funny. And since I asked for opinions, I can hardly fault you for giving one. Welcome to the controversy!
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2023
    cross_trainer, May 31, 2023
    cross_trainer, May 31, 2023
    #24
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  10. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    I do. :grinning-smiley-048:
     
    cross_trainer, May 31, 2023
    cross_trainer, May 31, 2023
    #25
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  11. Melankomas

    Melankomas Prime Jeffries would demolish a grizzly in 2 Full Member

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    I mean against 58 year old Ali, then that's a different question! Donovan ****s Ali up in that case
     
    Melankomas, May 31, 2023
    Melankomas, May 31, 2023
    #26
  12. cross_trainer

    cross_trainer Liston was good, but no "Tire Iron" Jones Full Member

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    If it hasn't appeared until now...will it?
     
    cross_trainer, May 31, 2023
    cross_trainer, May 31, 2023
    #27
  13. Melankomas

    Melankomas Prime Jeffries would demolish a grizzly in 2 Full Member

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    Footage of Langford vs. Jeannette didn't appear until 2010, same thing with the Greb training footage which didn't come until the early 90s. It's not impossible.
     
    Melankomas, May 31, 2023
    Melankomas, May 31, 2023
    #28
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  14. Nosferatu

    Nosferatu Corbett's thong is my proudest fap banned Full Member

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    I find it odd how Mike Donovan and Billy Edwards (especially in the second video) look better than Corbett, Fitzsimmons, Johnson and Ketchel. Real mindf#ck
     
    Nosferatu, Jun 9, 2023
    Nosferatu, Jun 9, 2023
    #29
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