Originally Posted by Robbi You could say there was more talent in the 40's, but with guys like Hopkins, Jones and Whitaker, there is no shortage of top end talent now, either. That wasn't me who posted the above.
I can't say i fully agree on the last paragraph; no doubt that Jones could've fought harder opponents, but for instance fighting Ruiz surely wasn't an easy one (only in hindsight). Also, i think Holyfield deserves credit for fighting anyone. You did not list him bold last page where you gave credit for the guys fighting under all circumstances, or something in those lines.
I see the Jones-Ruiz fight as a prime example of a showcase fight. Ruiz was a HW, sure, but he was a vulnerable HW with a baloney belt. He was not a banger, was fairly slow of hand and foot. The fact that he fought precisely the kind of fight in which to best demonstrate Jones' superiority merely highlighted it. This is a far, far cry from Arguello stepping up and facing the most dangerous of the JMW champions in Pryor. Alexis chose him in the name of greatness... becuase he wanted to beat the best. I went back and forth... but I don't see him quite the same as those noted above him. I'm prejudiced against HWs, although, I see Holyfield as probably higher on a p4p and ATG HW list than most on this site.
Sure did. I sent you two of them. One was a follow up to a post where I offered to give you a new kind of beating in the ring ("not kidding. What gym"), and the other asked you your weight -a question that you evaded. --That doesn't exactly constitute "obsession" -but your 30 some odd, man-love posts sure do. I take it you didn't get a key post with your name on it. Go look at the "Had Salvador Sanchez lived" thread.
"so?" Well at least you know you're an odd ball. Your humour is extremely childish and you seem to be here with virtually non-existent knowledge on the sport. Certainly nothing constructive or interesting. I wouldn't expect you to present your posts with wording and grammar like, eg Stonehands89, but at least get what knowledge you have between your ears down to your fingertips and onto your keyboard.
Not really. You're a nuisance who's easily flicked away. And I happen to like duels, but your sword is a mere needle, so I thought that your insistence on engaging me might be better satisfied in the ring. And it wasn't a threat, Mary, it was an invitation. I've since revoked it however, because I don't want to fulfill your manlove fantasies. I honestly get the feeling that you like nothing better than to rub against sweaty men in a boxing ring.
Stonehands. How did you manage to quote me on something ChrisPontius posted? A rare mistake by yourself.
Cheers. Well i'm one who rates Hopkins roughly his equal (H2H, a tad behind maybe at just 160 but higher P4P), and tho i think Duran would beat Whitaker in a competitive fight i still wouldn't like to have a gun to my head on the result being a forgone conclusion. It would certainly be an electric event, as much for the build up and wonder as the actual action probably. It would be very hard to debate any 135 over Duran with any force. Style wise Pernell is much better suited than just about anyone tho. He wouldn't be lured into any SRL type exchanges and it would all hinge on whether Whitaker could implement his style often and for long enough, or whether Duran could bustle him out of his comfort zone. I'm thinking i would make Duran either a 7-5 or 8-5 favourite, to get pedantic i think 3-2 is in order but i don't think i've ever seen those odds for the life of me :hey It's all in the eye of the beholder tho. I honestly believe post 1990 fighters are slightly underdone in here on the whole. If we pop over to General then they obviously go too far the other way, on the whole. Obviously there will be exceptions every which way. Hopkins and Whitaker in 30 years are going to have tremendous reputations.
Valid points. I grew up listening to stories of Robinson, Marciano, Pep, Louis, Lamotta, etc. Wonderful stories, but the flip side was hearing that Leonard, Duran, Hagler are great fighters BUT they're no (insert any name from 40's, 50's). When I came on the Classic forum, I was pleasantly surprised to see my heroes from the 80's getting their just due. I'd see whitaker giving Duran problems but falling short over 15 rounds. I think Hopkins presents a world of matchup problems to Hagler and I'd favor Hopkins H2H.