I've read many times from many sources though the years that fighters often lose when their spirit gives out .. as if it is always a matter of will ... often this is a Teddy Atlas sort of thing .. while I can try to understand his point to a degree, there are some times a fighter can simply go no more and is legitimately stopped .. interested on some thoughts of this .. I thought about it rereading Randy Robert's book on Louis that reiterated , again, how Braddock was simply knocked unconscious after giving every bit he had to go as far as he did .. any thoughts on this ?
Not sure I understand the breadth of the question well enough but I do believe that a HUGE part of boxing is mental, and that you have to have a certain fire in your belly to withstand a lot of what's coming at you. You lose that and suddenly being able to take big shots and fire back with your own and push on when you're exhausted just doesn't seem important enough to carry through. There are instances when a fighter is simply legitimately stopped because they just get physically taken out (your mention is a good one, along with Holmes against Tyson, Ali against Holmes, and thousands of others) but there are others like Arguello against Pryor the second time when after weighing pros and cons of the situation, the loser just decides it's no longer worth it and concedes.
Interesting topic There are instances where a guy is clearly done: Wilder vs Szpilka or Johnson vs Jones Jr where a guy is down and out and out for a long time The guy is in bad shape but still trying to get up but unable to continue: Berbick desperately trying to get up but falling around vs Tyson Guy getting to his feet but the referee not liking what he sees: Lewis vs McCall A fighter going down and waiting to be counted out but getting up at 9-10 to make it seem like he wanted to go on: Scott vs Chisora A fighter going down, seeing their fate, and staying down: Arguello vs Pryor 2 and Morales vs Pacquiao 3 Now a fighter getting cracked, hitting the deck and laying down like they are KO'd but can in reality continue, I'm not thinking of any examples quickly. I feel like I have seen others mention Tyson vs Etienne where he goes down and spits out the mouthpiece and just stays there but it was a very hard punch and a nasty fall I imagine in the over matched prospect building fights most stoppages are of the journeyman can but doesnt get up or the ref mercy stops it after the gulf in class is so large. I don't think at the elite level too many great prime fighters are just giving in
Baer quit vs Louis. He could of gotten up but knew it wouldn’t end well. Think that happened to couple of Louis opponents
Liston quit vs Ali in 1964, Tyson did not beat the count vs Douglas, 1990. Like another poster mentioned, true you have to be in condition, physically, but mentally as well too. Sometimes a fighter goes into a big fight with I have nothing to lose attitude, again Tyson vs Douglas, who had numerous personal tragedies as distractions, he won. Then many times, it is who wants it more, Mancini vs Frias, 1982, for his father. A poster told me last year it has to do with just conditioning, but your mind is a very powerful weapon.
To quote Ali, 90% of the time fighters can get up if they really want to. Isn't it funny how many boxer's rise at the count of 11! Braddock was tough if nothing else. Out of the ring for 2 years, he floored Louis and won another round, but could only take so much.
Always think of Max Baer against Joe Louis as far as quitting goes. Can’t really blame Walcott for the quit. Mentally I’d imagine most fighters would be shot after his previous KO
Mugabi reached the end of his will against Hagler. I suspected Douglas may have been similar against Tucker.
Very true. He claimed he misheard their count but I kind of lean towards he quit. Max Baer def quit lol he even said he could of gotten up.
I think Baer admitted he quit. in fairness he had taken some monster shots up until then which probably would have kept other fighters down.
