Rank them by punching power

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Unique Way, Aug 3, 2025 at 10:27 AM.


  1. Babality

    Babality KTFO!!!!!!! Full Member

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    1) Evan Fields
    2) Holmes
    3) Usyk
    3) Ali
    4) Evander Holyfield
     
  2. Dynamicpuncher

    Dynamicpuncher Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    And why this argument doesn't work either simply because.....

    Usyk's power was not stand out against fighters at Cruiserweight either only in the Bellew fight.

    Holyfield at Cruiserweight before he bulked up had more stoppages in world title fights at Cruiserweight than Usyk 5 compared to 3.

    So people that want to use the PED argument it doesn't work in that case.

    I also wish people would stop using size as an argument to determine how durable someone is.....

    Fury got floored by 210 pound Cunningham who had 1 stoppage out of 12 fights at Heavyweight and who also had a barely 40 percent stoppage ratio in total.

    Hurting or flooring Fury despite his size is not some rare feat.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2025 at 10:04 AM
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  3. dmt

    dmt Hardest hitting hw ever Full Member

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    I can agree to disagree with almost anyone on most things. But the insistence that bigger heavies are more durable despite all the evidence pointing otherwise just shows some people are immune from logic.

    On no planet are Fury, Wlad or Joshua more durable than Ali, Holmes and Tyson for example.

    Its just impossible to have a rational debate with people who insist that Luis Ortiz would beat Joe Frazier or Fury would somehow easily beat Foreman. We are just living in bizzarro world.
     
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  4. OddR

    OddR Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Size mattering is broad thing it doesn't mean there aren't expectations to the rule.

    But what I do say about the some the bigger heavyweights is they are often not in the best shape like say the Kiltschko's.
     
  5. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    So Usyk winning and unifying all his world titles in his opponent's backyards sans one which was on the road, whilst giving away huge or obscene physical advantages to giants and career HWs who are much bigger, heavier and more powerful than him, who hit really hard or extremely hard against fighters their own size and giants is actually a bad thing now and it would've been far more impressive if he was fighting SMW, LHW, and CW sized HWS he was much bigger in his own backyard? :facepalm:

    What next? It would've been far more impressive had he forged a career fouling the crap out of his opponents instead of being one of the cleanest fighters of all time and fought a bunch of featherfists instead of all those savage punchers and legit bangers he's fought, many way bigger than him, right?

    Or maybe he should launch into racial tirades, slap some women about, and beat some regular civilians up instead of conducting himself with the utmost class :facepalm:
     
  6. Boxed Ears

    Boxed Ears this my daddy's account (RIP daddy) Full Member

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    Ali having the stopping power to put away Foreman and Bonavena pretty much clinches this one for me on the first place. What you said about Holyfield makes him the trickiest to rate, I admit. Ali would never have thrown his weight into sustained attacks the way Evander did. Almost no fighter does it to the level of Holyfield. It's way too risky.

    The other three are curious enough but I pretty much understand why you'd put the four together on this thread. It's close enough. I'll go Holmes, Holy, Usyk. It's by hairs though.
     
  7. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    Some people are just absolutely loath to give Usyk any credit and they are super heavy on applying context when it comes to trying to discredit him but they completely ignore all context or play it down when it comes to anything positive regarding him.

    Again, because it got completely ignored the first time

    Ali's weights and the weights of his opponents

    Look how often he was the much or bigger man. Usyk is not fighting opponents who are SMW or LHW sized ''HWs'' and even at CW the guys he was fighting were bigger than the vast majority of Ali's opponents

    192-186
    193-191
    195-197
    193-177
    190-184
    192-181
    194-225
    192-189
    188-210
    193-205
    194-191
    195-189
    196-205
    196-189
    199-208
    204-191
    205-214
    202-188
    207-185
    210-218
    206-215
    210-196
    214-216
    201-188
    209-200
    204-195
    210-212
    212-212
    211-202
    213-197
    212-204
    215-205
    220-189
    227-256
    220-198
    226-211
    216-198
    217-223
    218-188
    221-180
    217-219
    221-210
    212-205
    217-196
    212-209
    223-225
    216-220
    224-219
    224-230
    224-215
    226-206
    230-209
    220-206
    221-217
    221-209
    225-211
    224-197
    221-201
    217-211
    236-218

    And Ali fought in the 15 round era and a whole bunch of his fights went the full 15 round distance or ended between round 13-15

    Usyk would have stopped more of his opponents had he had 15 rounds to do so. Hell, he came within a whisker of stopping Hunter and AJ in round 12 and many refs actually would've stopped the Hunter fight in round 12 and Belly in round 9 of his first fight vs Usyk.

    If Usyk had a home ref like so American fighters do pretty much all the time at home and Brits often do do you think the refs in those fights would've waved them off?

    Ali was outweighed by almost 30lbs vs Buster Mathis but he didn't stop him

    30lbs vs Duke Sabedong who again he couldn't stop

    He did stop Alex Miteff who outweighed him by 22lbs though

    Anyone with the gift of sight and a semi-functioning brain knows that Usyk is a slick boxer first who isn't trying to take you head off and if you **** him off or disrespect him a different altogether more spiteful Usyk will show up on the night who will try to punish and hurt you or knock you out and when he sits down on his shots and wants to hurt his opponent he actually hits hard.

    This is him sitting down on his power

    That finishing left hand he dropped Dubois with and the left hand he hurt Belly badly with are clearly very heavy shots

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  8. Dynamicpuncher

    Dynamicpuncher Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Ali before his exile had 23 stoppages out of 29 wins which is pretty much an 80 percent stoppage ratio with 8 stoppages in world title fights.

    If any Heavyweight had those stats now they would be deemed very impressive.
     
  9. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    Against opponents roughly his size or he was generally bigger than

    192-186
    193-191
    195-197
    193-177
    190-184
    192-181
    194-225 went the distance vs the opponent who outweighed him the most
    192-189
    188-210
    193-205
    194-191
    195-189
    196-205
    196-189
    199-208
    204-191
    205-214
    202-188
    207-185
    210-218
    206-215
    210-196
    214-216
    201-188
    209-200
    204-195
    210-212
    212-212
    211-202

    Usyk was 16-0 (12 KOs) at CW against opponents roughly his size give or take 1 or 2

    3 of the 4 guys he didn't stop have literally never been off their feet.

    I've never even seen Briedis get hurt, as in on wobbly legs, discombobulatized, or in any danger whatsoever of going down.


    Klitschko brother's former chef and camp manager on Briedis

    ''I knew Mairis was a danger and would win. Bad choice for Charr . Mairis can bang!''

    ''no
    but he was great at movement. You have to stay focused with Mairis at all times.''

    Mairis is a tough dude. Had him at least 6-8 times in Wlad and Vitalis camps. Always gives top work''

    ''Mairis can box that way is all day long, but dont be fooled, the boy has some power. Seen it first hand''

    ''I DID... but I know what Mairis was capable of from many many times in Klitschko camps.''

    James Ali Bashir on Briedis

    Said Briedis sparred Wlad numerous times and was never hurt by him, which he says is very rare for anyone who has sparred more than 30-40 rounds with Wlad.

    Time-stamped

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    And Wlad on Briedis

    ''Briedis is a former sparring partner of Vitali and myself and I know how good he is''

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    Gassiev hasn't come close to going down either and it's hardly the world's biggest secret he was a terror in the gym and has knocked out or hurt many ranked HWs in in sparring, not him getting knocked out by them

    And obviously Usyk's game plan was to box and move all night vs the extremely dangerous Gassiev. He wasn't loading up on his power

    Hunter has a great chin too


    And had Usyk turned pro in his teens as opposed to when he was almost 27 y/o and spent 8-9 years of his prime years in the pros when his speed, reflexes, and reaction times were at their sharpest he would've scored more stoppages.

    He was very noticeably faster in all these departments in his prime and he was already four months away from turning 35 when he won his first world title at HW and he's 38.5 now and in a matter of weeks will become the 5th oldest HW champ of all time, the 2nd oldest unified one, and the oldest ever undisputed one

    I'll wager his KO% at HW is actually impressive for a near 35 to 38.5 y/o especially when you factor in 3 of his 5 opponents were current or future HW champs, the #1 or #2 ranked fighters when he beat them sans Dubois in the first fight and that they were much or way bigger than him

    If he were to lose his next fight at likely 39 y/o to a much younger opponent 100% guaranteed he will be crucified for it and it will be deemed a huge stain on his legacy by so many and the fact he's 39 y/o will get conveniently ignored. I don't care if he knocked Dubois out in HL reel fashion in his last fight he's an old man in boxing terms and he's been past his prime for years. I've been a big fan of his for 18 years now so I know what I'm talking about
     
  10. Dynamicpuncher

    Dynamicpuncher Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Serge you've posted this 3 times now I really don't care I have my opinion you have yours stop trying to force it on me.

    In every Usyk thread you're constantly posting paragraph after paragraph glazing over him and accusing people of this and that it's getting quite tiring and I'm really not interested to be quite frank.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2025 at 2:37 PM
  11. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    No I haven't and I'm not trying to ''force'' anything on you.

    It's important context and it's absolutely relevant to the discussion

    If Usyk was fighting SMW, LHW and CW sized ''HWs'' at CW and HW over 15 rounds who he was very often bigger or much bigger than his KO% would be higher or lower?

    And it's tiring having to see people constantly ignoring important context in order to try and discredit him whist claiming to be objective and fans of his
     
  12. HistoryZero26

    HistoryZero26 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Ali
    Holyfield
    Holmes
    Usyk


    Alis clearly first and Usyks clearly last if we're going by the title level. Holmes had more power than Holyfield on average at the title level but Holyfield reached higher highs. Now theres a clear cynical explanation for that but I'm going to take it at face value.

    One way Holmes is last is that he had to go down the furthest in class to "look like" a dominant puncher. Holmes could get knockdowns and knockouts more consistantly then Holyfield and Usyk at the title level but if you dropped him a few levels this didn't change that much. With the other 3 it did. Even Usyk outside the CW title level had a 100% KO rate. Holmes didn't have very many "intermediate level" fights before and after winning the belt but after 40 fights of padding(and a lower title SOS than Ali) he still has a lower KO rate than Holyfield and Ali.

    Ali even in the latter stages of his career was a dominant puncher if you gave him an opponent outside of the top 10 or top 15.
     
  13. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    And I do not post in every Usyk thread. There's at least 4 Usyk threads on the front page alone I haven't posted in at all. A couple of then new threads the others days old so that's just not true

    I'm very open about the fact I'm an Usyk super fan. Hell, I admit I'm the CEO of Usyk inc.

    Ignoring important context is not being fair or objective
     
  14. Dynamicpuncher

    Dynamicpuncher Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    You say samething in every thread it's tiring I don't care.
     
  15. Serge

    Serge Ginger Dracula Staff Member

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    If you want to be arsy about it, fine I don't care either

    Or you could just try being a bit fairer and not ignoring important context. You claim to be fair and objective but that's not being fair or objective is it?