Rate their chins. Marciano, foreman or holmes?

1-but walcott hasnt done it. Its harder to hurt a man who weighs 40 more pounds than the other way around. Youre joshua vs flyweight example is stupid or youre trolling.

2-then rocky is severely lacking in the chin department. He did not face very many punchers and the ones he did were small and past their prime. We can only say he had a "good" chin, i cant rate him at the top i can only put an asterisk.

3-they were taller, bigger, longer reach, stronger, younger, and possibly hit harder based on ko%. Those are very significant factors.

If they were tomato cans what would you call ted lowry or some of the other guys rocky fought?

4-i dont care if you were there for every waking moment in walcotts life and gave him a handjob after each win. A 40 year old man is not the same physically as his 20 year old self.

I mean if your criteria is that taking a blow from a 40 year old man (one of his best opponents) makes rockys chin better than foreman or holmes because your logic is that walcoty did not decline in strength or power..

Then i guess anthony joshua had the best chin of all time by your logic. Most people agree wladmir improved with age, was 40 when he fought joshua, and dropped him but joshua got up and won. Wladmir was a top 10 if not top 5 atg puncher. Sound familiar?

 

Based on ability to take clean shots from heavy hitters
1. Foreman
2. Holmes
3. Marciano

 

I never said walcott was 20 when he fought louis lol what is this rubbish post for?

Outside of peds or weights there is no way he had he same physical strength and power in his late 30's as his 20's. Youd have to be mentally challenged to believe that.

 

1. It's an example of your reasoning. Just because a fighter didn't do something doesn't mean they couldn't. You do realize you're in the Classic Section where we primarily discuss fantasy match ups correct?
2. The ones he did face are atg's. One of which holds the record for the most knockouts in boxing history but apparently that doesn't mean anything to you.
3. So what notable opponents did David Bey and Renaldo Snipes knock out prior to fighting Holmes?
4. Yeah you're a ****ing ***. Go take it up the ass somewhere else.

I mean if getting knocked down by light punching Jimmy Young is your idea of a stellar chin then that just speaks for itself.

You have yet to provide video evidence of Walcott looking worse physically in his older years vs his younger years. If it were so easy then you would have posted it but since you have yet to do so your argument is therefore invalid.

 

Strawman all over your post as usual.

 

Dago: "Look at the Louis fights then look at the Marciano fights. There is no physical differences about Walcott whatsoever."

You: "ask your uncle or anyone with a degree in phys ed, a coach or former athlete if a 40 year old can keep up the same athleticism of a 20 year old."

So what the hell are you saying? You were asked to contrast Walcott's performances against Louis and Maricano, and you start talking about the differences between a 20 year old and 40 year old in sweeping generalizations.

It is quite possible to be a better fighter in your 30s than in your 20s.
It is quite possible to be physically stronger in your 30s than in your 20s.

And there are many possibilities as to how this could occur beyond PEDs and weights.

For starters, Walcott did not eat or train properly in his youth as explained to you countless times. When he returned to the sport in his 30s, he had access to nutrition and training that allowed him to reach a fighting peak he was unable to obtain in his youth.

You will find most power lifters peak in their mid and late 30s. Did Walcott lift weights? I'm not certain. Given his physique he certainly did resistance training of some kind. If not weights, like most fighters from that time I'm sure he worked with medicine balls, heavy bags, row machine...etc which can all add or maintain muscle mass.

A poster on here claimed his routine consisted of 500 push ups a day, that may not be power lifting but that is enough resistance training to add muscle and build power. Bummy Davis, another poster here, met him in his late 60s and was took back by how massively muscular he was for an older man, so at some point he likely got into weight training I would wager.

Walcott's physique from ages 35-38:

[url]http://static.boxrec.com/thumb/a/ad/Charles-Walcott_I_BE058915.jpg/275px-Charles-Walcott_I_BE058915.jpg[/url]

[url]https://68.media.tumblr.com/a60b8c068566567386c32376d0258c2e/tumblr_mjeqxnzBNX1qcma3zo1_500.jpg[/url]

[url]https://www.quotesdragon.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/12/Jersey-Joe-Walcott-quotes-and-sayings.jpeg[/url]

[url]http://i.imgur.com/9IsaJcP.jpg[/url]

 

So you want me to admit i was wrong about something then admit that its subjective a few sentences later?

Wow, what a load of horse manure

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Lewis was alert, on his toes, aggressive, and focused from the opening bell, hardly a fighter id call "fallig asleep". He got dropped fair and square.

Childish? You mean like how you keep repeating things you know arent true because it suits your agenda? Another trait of a politician. Im gonna just call you the kentucky congressman now.

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Youre a projecting, hypocritical liar. He drops quarry with a left hook at 33:40

In the clip you posted quarry had to use a sneaky shot when both men were in close quarters on an upright unsuspecting lyle. He stumbled a few steps and came right back to quarry.

Now if he were groggy eyed or legs shaking that would be a different story. The shot ali caught him with was far more telling.

Did you even read what i said? Frazier wasnt some scrawny 190 pounder, he had to get in tremendous shape and became a wall of stocky muscle to get down to the 205-210 range where he was like a work horse. Hence me calling him "bigger".

Ok congressman.

 

1-thats not how logic works you imbecile

[url]https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Philosophical_burden_of_proof#Proving_a_negative[/url]

You claimed he could hurt 240 pounders. Burden of proof is on you.

2-moore knocked out several LIGHT heavies where he spent the majority of his career. List some elite heavies he koed.

3-irrelevant to the comparison between walcott/moore and bey/snipes

4-lol you didnt like my joshua example? Did i touch a nerve? See how easy it is to use stupid ass examples to try to sound smart?

I dont have to prove anything. I know for a fact walcott was not just as athletic or strong as his 20 year old self.

 

In the text you quoted I stated the words "It's not subjective."

I would describe it as a defensive lapse or "falling asleep". Yes, it was fair and square.

I believe everything I say to be true.

Im aware, I pointed this fact out to you multiple times in this very thread.

I dispute your over simplified claim that the hook put him down for a 10 count for reasons that should be self evident. Its a misrepresentation of events, Quarry was up at a count of 1 and misunderstood the mandatory 8 count instructions.

You either didn't know that or you were deliberately being vague to portray it as a more devastating loss than it really was, while it was fair it was somewhat controversial. Even if it was a simple 10 count KO, there are still too many examples of Quarry defeating larger rated heavies to suggest it was an ongoing problem for him.

Sneaky or telegraphed, it doesnt really matter. A punch was landed that resulted in Lyle losing the ability to maintain a vertical base without support of the ropes.

Groggy eyes? His back is to camera. Shaking legs? He loses the ability to stand vertical.

Came right back to Quarry? He bounces off the ropes as Quarry moves in. He spends the remaining closing seconds of the round with his back on or close to tge ropes as Quarry looks to finish....why...because Lyle was hurt.

Stop acting like a ******, be a man, admit you never watched Quarry vs Lyle and had no idea the stuff happened until i made you aware of it.

Only 5 pounds heavier. That is the fact. I dont care if Frazier was 500 pounds and green two Sundays and a Wednesday before the fight. In the ring, he had a smaller weight advantage than the men I listed. That is undisputable.

And yes, you had no idea who Mac Foster was and thought Quarry fought Bob. You seem to know very little of Quarry in general. Im giving you a free education , and you are throwing spitballs.

 

1. I repeat you do realize you're in the Classic Section where we primarily discuss fantasy match ups correct? I have provided plenty of proof whereas you haven't provided a shred of proof that Walcott had declined physically. There's that burden of proof again. You're a hypocrite.
2. Bob Baker, Bob Satterfield, Jimmy Bivins, and Bob Dunlap.
3. It is completely relevent. To be an elite heavyweight puncher you have to knock out elite heavyweights. Who were they?
4. No you started talking about giving guys handjobs. You're a ***.


No video evidence supports your side.

 

Don't think Holmes was ever put down by Bey. Maybe you are thinking of Renaldo Snipes?

 

I would add Lavorante. He was a 6'3 211 pound top rated fighter who had knocked out Zora. He was took out of the ring in a stretcher.

Not just elite wins either, Moore displayed unique power at HW in other ways.

-He gave Lovell his only KO loss since his debut and Lovell was no push over, he was the #2 guy behind Godoy in the tough Argentine scene.
-The one punch KO over the than up and coming Davidson is impressive given the size difference
-He knocked out Whitehurst who would go the distance with Liston, Satterfield, and Bob Foster.
-Besmanoff had only suffered a corner retirement to Liston in his last 20 losses when Moore stopped him.
-He has several solid KO wins over Musacto, Buddy Walker, and the sheer number of KOs he had over men that were 175 plus. He actually knocked out more Heavies than any other single weight class.

 

Foreman
Holmes
Marciano

Being a tough guy isn't entirely what taking a punch around the head, and not going down is about.
Foot stance and balance is very important, and career two Foreman had remarkable balance, especially when you consider his age.

 

I remember him getting knocked down during the fight. Just did a quick google search and found this:
[url]http://www.gettyimages.com/detail/news-photo/larry-holmes-falls-to-the-canvas-after-being-knocked-down-news-photo/164130326?esource=SEO_GIS_CDN_Redirect#larry-holmes-falls-to-the-canvas-after-being-knocked-down-by-david-picture-id164130326[/url]

Now that I look at it I'm not sure if it was a push or a punch or what it was. I'll have to rewatch the fight.

 

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Found it. It looks like it wasn't a knockdown after all. I can't tell if Bey made contact with Holmes' chin with a punch but for these purposes I will say it was NOT a knockdown.