Ray Arcel and Freddie Brown on No Mas.

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by JohnThomas1, Sep 19, 2018.


  1. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Can't say i've seen much of this around and it certainly deserves it's own thread as this topic comes around yearly or better. This should be good.

    Ray Arcel

    I wish i could give you an honest answer. I always thought this guy would fight until he dropped. I just can't figure it out. I've got no answer now. I don't know. I don't know. He's been so sharp in the last week of training.

    Freddie Brown

    At the weigh in repelling rumors of trouble making the weight - "I feel just as good about this fight as i did about Montreal. I should feel better because i know Duran's in better shape."

    Three years later - Saying that he'd invented the story of stomach cramps, Brown told Dick Young "I couldn't stand the thought of him being disgraced. He was too great a fighter for that. So i said to him "Tell them you had bad cramps." He had no cramps. He had nothing. He was in better shape than he was for the first fight with Leonard."

    Brown also criticized Ray Arcel for allegedly telling television viewers that Duran had quit for no explainable reason. "I couldn't do that" Brown said. If they knew in Panama he'd quit, they'd of murdered him when he got back, so i made the alibi".
     
  2. Longhhorn71

    Longhhorn71 Boxing Junkie Full Member

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  3. Jel

    Jel Well-Known Member Full Member

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    Yeah, it's weird that Freddie Brown would say that because to the naked eye Duran looked in far better shape for the Montreal fight.
     
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  4. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Where did you get the quotes from?
     
  5. steve21

    steve21 Member Full Member

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    Of all the stuff around, this makes the most sense - no excuses, no crap. For whatever reason - likely he was just sick of Leonard's tactics - he quit. That's it. Every human being has moments of seemingly irrational behavior (some of us have made a lifestyle of it :wave:). No reason to believe Roberto Duran is any different; his moment was just broadcast across the airwaves and recorded for eternity. From all I gather, he doesn't really give two damns, and is living a happy life. He may wish the rest of do the same ...

    spt
     
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  6. KuRuPT

    KuRuPT Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    It's fine, but it calls into question all of what Freddie Brown had to say, when he makes statements like "Duran was in better shape"... You can look at him in both fights and he certainly wasn't in better shape for N.O.
     
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  7. mrkoolkevin

    mrkoolkevin Not here for the fairy tales Full Member

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    :icon_popcorn:
     
  8. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Corner Men.
     
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  9. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Thanks!
     
  10. Bokaj

    Bokaj Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    So two guys in his camp says he was in great shape. That goes a pretty long way for me.
     
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  11. PernellSweetPea

    PernellSweetPea Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This supports the no excuse theory. I always thought or knew if Ray fought Duran the same way he did in the first fight Duran might have won again.
     
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  12. META5

    META5 Active Member Full Member

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    Kinda.

    A couple of things to note here for me:

    The fight wasn’t the wide embarrassment that legend has built it to be. Duran wasn’t being blown out on the scorecards.

    Duran didn’t look as physically fit or as sharp as in Montreal on film. He just didn’t look as ‘dynamic’ - some will say that’s because SRL fought his fight and I would contend that the comments from Angelo and Ray before Montreal as well as Leonard on film prior to Montreal suggest that Ray fought his fight the first time around and found Duran to be elite.

    I’ve always believed that Ray’s tactics i.e. the movement and bolo punches and clowning combined with Duran’s visible ‘comparative difference’ led to him making that fated decision in the midst of his bruised ego and pride. It’s like Roberto just got caught up in his feelings.

    The cynic in me asks if these comments were issued as if to say, “Look, we did our job better than the last time. Duran was in great shape - you cannot blame us for him not looking as conditioned as before!”.

    Maybe it’s just a tactical statement to place the blame squarely at Duran’s feet?
     
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  13. KuRuPT

    KuRuPT Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Exactly how these comments could be made. They wanted to save Duran's "life" by making an excuse for him on why he quit. Yet, they would be adverse to building up their own side of things as to not try and criticism from these same threatening people that would go after Duran? Seems like if they felt this strongly that they needed to lie for him... why wouldn't they feel they needed to lie to protect themselves. Say for instance, if they knew Duran wasn't as good and didn't postpone the fight... If that came out... wouldn't that mean they were in line for some of these same repercussions they were worried about with Duran?

    I think it's pretty clear Visually he wasn't the same... but who knows.
     
  14. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

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    Brown and Arcel perhaps were defending themselves in a sense. They dont wwnt to be known as the trainers who sent man not prepared. Duran struggling with the weight doesn't mean he wasn't in good condition. He could be and also Wilt for the weight loss.
     
  15. KuRuPT

    KuRuPT Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    You're Unforgivable then.
     


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