You're not wrong, but it at least highlights how Dempsey handled larger men when they attempted to impose their size upon him. Lennox Lewis may have beaten Jack, but while he was very good at leaning on fighter's he would probably find it much more difficult against Dempsey who could sift rapid blows through tiny gaps. There is a strong argument that Dempsey was the best in-fighter at heavyweight.
Carl Morris was a fat, untrained has-been on a losing streak coming into his fights with Dempsey. The local papers even wondered if he would show for the fights.
He was seen as a top contender in his day. Perhaps the real question is "how good would he need to be, before the result of the fight becomes a serious problem, for people arguing for Mercer based on his size".
The still prime Dempsey fired some truly lighting fast body shots against Carpentier that look murderous even today.
he, try as I may I can't figure out your true position ala Jack Dempsey ? You laud him on his unusual positive assets as a destructive heavyweight agreeing with his contemporaries long dead, but in all your posts you have him losing to any modern "big" heavyweight not named Butterbean. I'm baffled...Oh well....
Dempsey by decision. Mercer was slow, he was easy to hit, and wasn't a huge puncher. Yes, he had a great chin. He actually developed a decent jab later in his career. His power was fair but not as great as some think it was. The KO wins over Damiani and Morrison look awesome but neither man was all that durable. Damiani was clearly outboxing Mercer until a well placed uppercut landed right on the tip of Damiani's nose. Nice desperation KO and Damiani was counted out. Oliver McCall stopped Damiani in the 8th round 2 years later. Morrison unloaded on Mercer for 3 1/2 rounds and Mercer took it well. He hurt Morrison late in the 4th round. We all know Morrison's chin wasn't granite. In the 5th, Mercer landed some good shots on Morrison and honestly, the fight could have been stopped a little sooner. Mercer was clearly outboxed by a past prime but well prepared Larry Holmes. I had it 118-110 for Holmes. Mercer beat Jerry Jones W8, Ossie Ocasio WSD8, Kimmual Odem W12, Bert Cooper W12... the KO wins over Damiani and Morrison, then the loss to Holmes. After Holmes Mercer stopped Mike Dixon and Wimpy Halstead, then he was upset by Jesse Ferguson in a shameful fight. He tried to talk Ferguson into taking a dive so Mercer would get a big payday vs. Riddick Bowe, who was the HW Champ at the time. Ferguson got the fight and was stopped in the 2nd round. Mercer beat Ferguson by close decision in the rematch WSD10. Mercer struggled with Mario Wilson and got a draw for his trouble. Mercer came to fight vs. Holyfield but lost by decision. Mercer was down for the first time in this fight. ABout a year after the Holyfield fight he gave Lennox Lewis a hell of a fight but lost LMD10. A case can be made that he should have beat Lewis. Mercer beat a past prime Tim Witherspoon W10, in his next fight. It was a pretty good scrap. A 14 month layoff followed, then a string of KO wins vs. bums, then it was mostly downhill. 2-1 (2) in WBO HW Title fights and 36-7-1 (26 )overall. He was stopped twice. They would both come to the ring at 6'1" with a 77" reach. Dempsey would be very solid at about 190 Lbs. Mercer wasn't ripped and he'd come in about 30Lbs. heavier. Dempsey had good speed, a high workrate, good stamina, a good chin, and power. He beat the likes of Fireman Jim Flynn (he was stopped in the 1st round by Flynn and he stopped Flynn in the 1st round, Willie Meehan (he went 1-2-2 vs. Meehan), Gunboat Smith W4 and KO2, Carl Morris W4, WDQ6, and KO1, Homer Smith KO1, Bill Brennan KO6 and KO12, Billy Miske D10, W6, KO3, Fred Fulton KO1, Battling Levinsky KO3, Jess Willard KO3, Georges Carpentier KO4, Tommy Gibbons W15, Luis Firpo KO2, and Jack Sharkey KO6. He lost 2 decisions to Gene Tunney late in his career. He did drop Tunney in their rematch. 66-6-11 (51) overall, 6-2 (5) in HW World Title fights, and he was only stopped once.
He was a fat, untrained slob who was was 3-4 over his last 7 coming into the first Dempsey bout. Somewhere in my research I have the clipping where the papers are even wondering if he would show up for their New Orleans bout such was his reputation for not training or generally giving a **** about the sport. The cognoscenti of the day were not impressed by that time.
So what if some small cruiserweight who doesnt care to bulk up, and is basically big lhw, annihilated Sam Peter after/before the Helenius fight? Has he got your attention? This content is protected This content is protected
Hi Burt .. I try to be consistent and keep it clear .. I think I look at him objectively .. I always say we have no idea how good he may have been because of the inactivity .. I don't see him losing to all bigger guys but I don't think he matches up well against highly skilled bigger guys based on what I've seen .. as a cruiser he was a terror based on what I've seen ..
There are two heavyweights, Joe Louis and the young Mike Tyson who in my opinion would have the best chance to beat a peak Jack Dempsey...Among the bangers not named Ali, Louis and Tyson hit amazingly FAST and hard for heavyweights, whilst a Lewis, Foreman ,Liston though powerful one punch hitters, a Dempsey bobbing and weaving would always beat to the punch, and my gut instinct tells me that speed "kills" amongst the big boys. I truly believe that the Dempsey in his prime was one tough S.O.B. and would be a match for any fighter ever, though he left the ring in his very prime for La Dolce Vita...Though a Carl Morris, Fred Fulton, Jess Willard, Luis Angel Firpo were not particularly skilled I believe they were as strong and able to absorb punishment til the cows came home. And the Manassa Mauler pulverized these tough blokes, for sure...
In these Dempsey threads it's often mentioned, that in the 50s veteran boxing writers voted him the greatest heavyweight ever. So I'm wondering: how was Dempsey rated by his contemporaries, who saw him in his prime in the early 20s? Did knowledgeable boxing people believe - back then - that he was the best heavyweight, they had ever seen... or is this an opinion, that didn't really take form until many years later?
