Real talk from Dan Rafael on Kirkland vs. Molina

so there is grey area. As I recall the guy didn't even get through the ropes, nor was, as you say, Kirkland in a neutral corner. So it was a giant **** up on Schorle's behalf. Not to mention interering with the count wouldn't have mattered a damn bit as Molina wasn't hurt.

Sad outcome to the fight but people **** up. Van Hoye's card is the real disgrace of the night in my opinion, that is simply inexcusable.

 

As I posted before on the second page of this thread the ref's hands are tied when it comes to this, hell he went over to the side to get clarification about this.

 

Jon Schorle made Joe Cooper look like referee of the decade.

 

molina, although ugly, fought an effective plan against kirkland....he took advantage of james's defensive issues and was hitting with accurate counterpunches in between the clinching...if molina had more pop he could have dropped him numerous times...i knew molina's spoiling style would make a difference but it went almost too well..kirkland looked flat...i would say overtrained but he didnt slow down and was roaring back in the 10th round with that kd...the DQ may have been a ****ed up ending to a fight that was prolly heading towards a definite conclusion in the last 2 rounds..but thats on molina's cornerman...boxing 101 says cornerman doesnt enter the gotdamn ring while the ref is adminstering a count..but molina put in good work and i would welcome a rematch for this...put it on a big card or something

 

wow....he is dead on....i hope everyone in the boxing world reads that, prints that, and hears it over and over :good

 

Steve Kim wrote an article about, it's pretty good as well.

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What’s ironic is that while one rule violation was blithely endorsed by Schorle, this contest was decided by a rule taken to the absolute letter of the law. Yes, a rule was broken but its spirit wasn’t, because it was designed to prevent undue interference from a fighter’s seconds. This simply didn’t occur in this instance. There was some confusion at the end of that eventful 10th frame when it looked like Kirkland finally extricated himself from the Molina’s vise grip to finally rattle his cage. But soon, as Schorle was huddling with ringside officials, the fight was waved off because Molina’s trainer made his way onto the ring apron (after the bell had rung) and Molina was clearly beating the count.

Six drama-filled minutes were taken from everyone witnessing this contest as Kirkland was declared the winner via disqualification. Just as it had gotten interesting, the plug was pulled. Dr. Jack Kevorkian couldn’t have done a better job of killing off something so stunningly and effectively.

What really got KO’d here was good ol’ fashioned common sense. Seriously, did Floyd Mayweather really deserve to lose his undefeated mark because his uncle, Roger, wanted to inflict some street justice on Zab Judah after “Super” blasted his nephew below the belt rather intentionally back in 2006? C’mon, that would’ve been a travesty and miscarriage of justice and just really stupid and illogical. No real advantage was gained on Saturday night by Molina’s trainer going into the ring when he did. In fact, he was just doing his job.

Another maddening aspect of this whole mess is that, if a corner exists, state inspectors are in each one supervising the camps. I’ve seen it numerous times; when a fighter has a big moment, the corner reacts by standing up and exhorting its fighter. Immediately, they are pulled back down to their seats by members of the commission. Nowadays, they are even discouraged from throwing in the towel on behalf of their boxers. Yet, on this night, somehow Molina’s chief second was allowed to go all the way up into the ring? It’s pretty obvious that maybe the Texas rangers had no recognizance of their own rules or were just derelict in their duties. Molina’s trainer cannot get up there without the permission of the inspectors.

Texas allowed Kirkland to be put into a straitjacket all night. Then they knocked out Molina on a technicality. And everybody lost.

On this night, a rule that was followed overshadowed a rule that wasn’t.

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He got him an extra 2-3 seconds to recover as the ref had to break the count to get him out, then continued the count once the corner guy was out...so yeah he did interfere. As I've said the entire time, I agree it sucks, and I hate that it ended that way, but to act as if you can't wrap your mind around why just seems ******ed to me.

 

Tell that to Dan Rafael, Steve Kim and Doug Fisher from The Ring. :conf

...not withstanding the majority of ESB'ers.

 

We all know Fat Dan is a fat ***** - but this ***** knows his boxing. Period.

Agree entirely.

 

Also two things that need to be cleared up:

-Molina was hurt and the knockdown was a knockdown. (see 12:30 of video provided) straight right on the chin.

-The cornerman got all the way into the ring, both feet standing in the ring, not "on the apron"...not "a foot in the ring". This is also very clearly demonstrated in the video.

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9PKqOQd2WI[/ame]

 

Well I kinda just did...lol, I'll put consideration into writing letters to Rafael/Kim/Fisher...

 

I doubt those extra 2-3 seconds factored into the ref's thinking.

My guess is that he failed to hear the bell. He didn't know the round was over, because if he did, then he would have acknowledged the cornerman setting the stool for his fighter after the round had finished, was not a big deal. Certainly not enough to disqualify a fighter for it.

 

It's not the first time this has happened, not sure why now it's such a point of contention, when almost this exact scenario has unfolded before. I'm not any happier about it than anyone else, but there's no need to act irrational about it. The rules are clear, the corner violated the rules, the ref acted on it...it sucks but it is what it is.

 

i dont think the round was over. if a fighter is knocked down during the bell, the ref must perform a count and then the bell rings again once the count is completed and the fighter is fit to continue.

there is no one here that can 100 percent unequivocally say that kirkland was not going to ko molina in the next two rounds.