Real talk here how do you rate Wilders win over Ortiz?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by Infern0121, Jun 1, 2018.


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  1. Infern0121

    Infern0121 Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    To Wilder haters this win is seen as being an unimpressive win over a 39 year old never-was, who was clearly on the slide, wilder was saved by the ref and only won because Ortiz gassed.

    To wilder hardcores its one of the greatest wins of the decade over a fearsome, avoided heavyweight who would have knocked out any man but Wilder on that night


    So what's the truth?

    In my opinion its somewhere in the middle.

    Ortiz in my opinion did get overrated on the back of that Bryant Jennings fight, Jennings was a servicable contender and it was a great KO, but I remember saying at the time that Ortiz was months, not years from hitting the downwards slide.

    In my opinion he did get showed up a bit by Dave Allen and Malik Scott, looking low on creativity and somewhat plodding. Two PED busts also cast aspersions on his career.

    But in the Wilder fight what I will say is he turned the clock back as best he could, was in the best shape he could be and gave his best effort.

    I consider it a good victory, but just shy of Elite.

    Ortiz WAS at least 39 years old, and doesn't have an elite level resume.

    Your thoughts?
     
    Infern0121, Jun 1, 2018
    Infern0121, Jun 1, 2018
    #1
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  2. NoNeck

    NoNeck Pugilist Specialist

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    Sort of like Lewis over Mercer or Tyson over Ruddock.
     
    NoNeck, Jun 1, 2018
    NoNeck, Jun 1, 2018
    #2
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  3. MVC!

    MVC! The Best Ever Full Member

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    An incredible win against an undefeated opponent. Possibly one of the best hw wins of the decade.

    Wilder is amazing.
     
    MVC!, Jun 1, 2018
    MVC!, Jun 1, 2018
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  4. GolovKing

    GolovKing ESB Since 2006 Full Member

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    Wilder stopped a bonafide world class contender. Not an elite pound for pound guy like Joshua but a world class fighter, nonetheless. It’s a big win.
     
    GolovKing, Jun 1, 2018
    GolovKing, Jun 1, 2018
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  5. Gil Gonzalez

    Gil Gonzalez Boxing Addict banned Full Member

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    Better than any of AJ’s wins. AJ’s only win worth mentioning was over a thrice shot to **** Wlad. If AJ fights someone as good as Ortiz, then he can be in the conversation. Until then, Wilder has the best resume in the heavyweight division.
     
    Gil Gonzalez, Jun 1, 2018
    Gil Gonzalez, Jun 1, 2018
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  6. GolovKing

    GolovKing ESB Since 2006 Full Member

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    Yup.
     
    GolovKing, Jun 1, 2018
    GolovKing, Jun 1, 2018
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  7. MrFoFody

    MrFoFody Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The truth is that Ortiz was the boogie man of the heavyweight division and made everyone in the top ten hide under their bedsheets
     
    MrFoFody, Jun 1, 2018
    MrFoFody, Jun 1, 2018
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  8. Infern0121

    Infern0121 Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    I deal in facts not opinions

    We have to Judge Ortiz based on his achievements
     
    Infern0121, Jun 1, 2018
    Infern0121, Jun 1, 2018
    #8
  9. Guybino

    Guybino Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Good win - thats it.

    Luis never fought for a world title before and probably never will again. It speaks volumes when a "39" year old PED cheat who has never fought for a title before is your best win.
     
    Guybino, Jun 1, 2018
    Guybino, Jun 1, 2018
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  10. Jackomano

    Jackomano Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    This. At the moment Wilder by far has the best resume in the heavyweight division. Joshua in all honesty should've had to earn that vacant WBA belt against Ortiz, who was the interim champ instead of a retired, unranked, and shot Wlad. Ortiz let Joshua take the easy fight against Wlad and afterwards Joshua shamelessly ducked him.
     
    Jackomano, Jun 1, 2018
    Jackomano, Jun 1, 2018
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  11. khaosai galaxi

    khaosai galaxi Superbad Full Member

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    Ok win for current landscape discussion.
    Nothing to write home about in all time sense.
     
    khaosai galaxi, Jun 1, 2018
    khaosai galaxi, Jun 1, 2018
    #11
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  12. Bensub

    Bensub Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Prob the first fight Ortiz wasn't on the juice so nobody on this forum actually knows how good he is. What are Ortizs best 2 wins??
     
    Bensub, Jun 1, 2018
    Bensub, Jun 1, 2018
    #12
  13. Infern0121

    Infern0121 Well-Known Member banned Full Member

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    I think the best way to look at this is in 10 years time will people look back on Luis Ortiz and wax lyrical about that bryant jennings win?

    Probs not
     
    Infern0121, Jun 1, 2018
    Infern0121, Jun 1, 2018
    #13
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  14. junkhead

    junkhead My dogs watch me post Full Member

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    Brittiii good, definitely a solid and good name no doubts about it
     
    junkhead, Jun 1, 2018
    junkhead, Jun 1, 2018
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  15. Brighton bomber

    Brighton bomber Loyal Member Full Member

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    It's a good win, other than Joshua and Fury's win over Wlad it's probably the best win on any active heavyweights resume right now. That clearly and unquestionably puts Wilder in the top 3 of the division behind Joshua.

    But I said even before the Scott and Allen fights that Ortiz wasn't the monster he was made out to be by some, he has some glaring flaws. The Jennings fights flattered Ortiz. Firstly how good is Jennings he looked good vs Wlad in a losing effort but Wlad was on the slide and ready to be taken but Jennings couldn't do enough to win. Jennings fought a terrible fight vs Ortiz literally fought like an idiot and as a non puncher went toe to toe with Ortiz, maybe he hadn't fully recovered from his first loss and was looking to impress to much on his return, either way he played right into Ortiz's hands.

    No Neck comparing Ortiz to Mercer and Rudduck seems about right. Like Ortiz both are dangerous but never had the tools to beat the very top guys. Both like Ortiz fought in spurts and could be out worked.

    But one good win is meaningless overall, it's a fighters complete body of work that defines his worth. Guys like Rahman, Sanders, McCall, Douglas, L. Spinks, etc all had 1 win better than anything on Wilder's resume, anyone can get lucky and catch the right guy at the right time. Wilder needs to prove more if he wants a lasting legacy.
     
    Brighton bomber, Jun 1, 2018
    Brighton bomber, Jun 1, 2018
    #15
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