Replace Holyfield with Spinks at Heavyweight

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Addie, Jul 9, 2009.


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  1. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Assume that Michael Spinks came around when Holyfield did and moved up to the Heavyweight division after dominating at Light Heavyweight. Instead of having to face Holmes, Conoey, and Tyson. How would he have fared had Spinks been faced with Holyfield's competition.

    vs Bowe '92
    vs Tyson '96
    vs Lewis '99
    vs Foreman '91

    This might have been a confusing question. Just replace Holyfield with the Spinks that fought Holmes in all of those match-ups?
     
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    #1
  2. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    He should be able to outbox Foreman, but Foreman may catch up to him, cant see him doing anything but get ko'd by the rest. Maybe the Tyson loss is making him underrated at HW though
     
    PowerPuncher, Jul 9, 2009
    PowerPuncher, Jul 9, 2009
    #2
  3. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Considering no other Light Heavweight in history would have beaten peak Mike Tyson at Heavyweight, perhaps you're being a little bit dismissive with his chances against those guys. Spinks did successfully take on undefeated Holmes and be the first to give him a loss, and then went on to stop the good but not great Gerry Cooney. Impressive work.

    I think the Spinks of Holmes 1 would box circles around old Foreman, and it would be even more wide than when Big George fought Evander. He had improved technically, but he was perhaps even slower than in Zaire, whereas Spinks was still close to his best days. George was big at 6'4, but Spinks wasn't that small either at 6'3. I don't see the size difference being an issue here.

    Briefly, I would favor Spinks over the Tyson of '96. Mike wasn't the same post-prison, he couldn't maintain his work rate, and his head movement was nothing like it used to be. If Holyfield can break him down, I would expect Spinks to do a similar job. There was no aura of invincibly surrounding Mike at this time.

    Peak versions of Lewis and Bowe, however, I think Spinks goes the distance but loses heavily on the scorecards. If any of those two are going to knock Spinks out though, it would be Lennnox.

    Opinions?
     
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
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  4. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    :patschWorkate? He only needs to hit him once in the first 30seconds :lol:
     
    PowerPuncher, Jul 9, 2009
    PowerPuncher, Jul 9, 2009
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  5. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    :lol: Assuming Michael makes it out of the first 30 seconds, I think it would be a tough fight, one that would favor Spinks as the fight goes on. Like I said before, you can't just assume post prison would have done the same thing to Spinks in my view. Two different fighters. There was no aura of invincibility surrounding Mike, his skills had eroded to the point where his head movement was not on the same level, and he couldn't maintain a good enough work rate over 12 rounds to beat man of Spinks quality. His confidence was never what it was after Douglas took him out in Tokyo.
     
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
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  6. djanders

    djanders Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I think Spinks loses to Bowe 3 times, loses to Tyson twice, loses to Lewis twice, and loses to Foreman once. 0-8-0. Those guys could hit! These are terrible matchups for Spinks...in my opinion.
     
    djanders, Jul 9, 2009
    djanders, Jul 9, 2009
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  7. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Sounds like people think Holyfield was a better fighter than Michael Spinks? They were pretty much the same size, and if Holyfield can hang with those guys, I think Spinks could too.
     
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
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  8. bxrfan

    bxrfan Sizzle Full Member

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    It's that knockout loss to Tyson that makes Spinks underrated. People forget he beat guys like Mustapha Muhammad, Marvin Johnson, Qawi, Holmes x2, etc.
     
    bxrfan, Jul 9, 2009
    bxrfan, Jul 9, 2009
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  9. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    The guy has a fantastic resume.

    I think Holyfield gets the same treatment if he ever fought the version of Tyson that Spinks was up against. Not as quick, but he would have been stopped. It's no shame in a Light Heavyweight getting knocked out by that guy.
     
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    #9
  10. Muchmoore

    Muchmoore Guest

    The key difference between Holyfield and Spinks at HW was that Holyfield was strong. He was able to tire out Tyson by pushing him all over the ring and simply outmuscling him. No way is Spinks anywhere near strong enough to employ this tactic.

    Holy's chin is also among the best ever, while Spinks showed in his fight with Tyson that he couldn't take Tyson's power. Tyson's power was the same after prison as it was when he fought Spinks, just his delivery was off. For Holyfield to beat Tyson, he had to absorb some monster shots (namely the 5th) that Spinks couldn't of taken.

    Tyson anywhere pre Lewis would knock out Spinks. Very few LHW's, if any, beat the post prison Tyson.
     
    Muchmoore, Jul 9, 2009
    Muchmoore, Jul 9, 2009
    #10
  11. ironchamp

    ironchamp Boxing Addict Full Member

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    1. Spinks decisions Old Foreman.

    2. Tyson of 1996 may not have been the Tyson of 1988 but his style IMO is all wrong for Spinks. Holyfield fought Tyson using holding and bully tactics. He fought a very physical fight against Tyson and in the process took alot of punishment. Unless Spinks changes his style its quite possible that the result remains a Tyson win, although I don't think it would be in the first round.

    3. Lennox Lewis in 1999 would have outboxed Michael Spinks, if not stopped him

    4. Riddick Bowe would be a tough one to pick. I lean towards Bowe but Spinks darting in and out and potshotting Riddick to a close decision victory is not out of the question.

    His record would be

    2-6 (beating Bowe once in 3 fights and beating Foreman).

    He'd lose to Tyson twice and Lewis Twice and of course Bowe twice.
     
    ironchamp, Jul 9, 2009
    ironchamp, Jul 9, 2009
    #11
  12. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Fair points.

    How does Spinks do against '92 Bowe and '91 Foreman in your view?
     
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    #12
  13. Muchmoore

    Muchmoore Guest

    Spinks jab and right hand would give Bowe absolute fits. Spinks wouldn't of been dumb enough to get drawn into a slugfest with the much bigger man like Holyfield was, he'd stick and move for the duration.

    But ultimately, Bowe's huge edge in size, power, durability would be too much and he'd probably take out Spinks in the mid to late rounds. It would be too hard to avoid Bowe over the duration and he'd be tired out by the movement and fighting the much bigger man. Spinks may have a chance though.

    Spinks-Foreman is a tossup. Spinks would be outpointing him the entire fight, and while I think Foreman's power in his comeback is over rated, the fact that he's huge and had enough power to take out Spinks makes it hard to pick against him.
     
    Muchmoore, Jul 9, 2009
    Muchmoore, Jul 9, 2009
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  14. Addie

    Addie Myung Woo Yuh! Full Member

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    Well, thanks for the input.

    I can agree that Tyson is just all wrong for Michael Spinks. It's hard to argue when we know what happened when they did fight. A blowout.

    I didn't give Michael much chance against the 6'5 skilled Heavyweight Lennox Lewis much chance to begin with.

    I think he's more competitive with Bowe because Riddick has been out jabbed by good jabbers before, and is not an elusive target. Still favor Bowe because his size and strength should come through in the latter rounds.

    I think Michael wins almost every round against '91 Foreman. I think Spinks was a terrific fighter, even up at Heavyweight, and George was just to slow to time Spinks.
     
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    Addie, Jul 9, 2009
    #14
  15. PowerPuncher

    PowerPuncher Loyal Member Full Member

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    Rewatch Tyson Holyfield 1, for the first 5 rounds Tyson was winning and Holyfield took some brutal punches, if that was Spinks in there then he wouldnt take the shots because his chin isnt as good.

    The again Spinks may have been past prime against Tyson but still Tyson is all wrong for him

    Saying he loses to all punchers maybe wrong but his chin and strength at the weight isnt as good as Holyfield. Old Foreman he probably outboxes at his best, Bowe maybe he can outbox if Bowe is out of shape, but Prime Bowe beats him. Lennox is all wrong for him too and takes him out early-mid rounds
     
    PowerPuncher, Jul 9, 2009
    PowerPuncher, Jul 9, 2009
    #15
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