Replace Tunney with Archie Moore for his title fights with Dempsey - what happens?

Mc, your still trotting out that old bromide of the Dempsey ko at the hands of Jim Flynn in 1917, before Dempsey hooked up with Jack Kearns...This fight was one of TWO things...
1- an abberation
2- Dempsey most likely took a dive as his divorced wife testified in court as they needed dough to eat and Dempsey was still helping his old ma and pa out financially...I still believe this the most likely scenario, but whatever transpired that day, a short time later Dempsey returned the compliment by flattenning Jim Flynn SOON LATER in less than a round...
To use this one fight in young Dempsey's career to suggest that Jack Dempsey was not rugged and couldn't take a great wallop is BOGUS, as all the descriptions of Dempsey suggest that he had a GREAT chin,and as Tunney wrote, Dempsey after taking a hard blow on the chin had such a
quick recovery time...Mc you'll have to come up with something more valid
than the Flynn fight to diminish Dempsey's great legacy to justify your obvious dislike of him....
A sidenote : In 1950, an acquaintance of mine, MW Harold Green flattened
Joey Giardello with one left-hook in the 6th round. Giardello had about
30 bouts at that time, and I saw Joey from ringside out cold...Now Harold Green was an average puncher, and my point is NO ONE THEN nor today, brings up this ko to reflect on the greatness of the later Giardello...?
Dempsey ONLY TODAY get's the shaft by some posters who NINETY YEARS later , CLASH with all the great fighters as Sam Langford, Gene Tunney,
Jack Sharkey, Mickey Walker, Max Schmeling, and the great trainers of the roaring twenties who seeing the prime Manassa Mauler at his best called him an all-time great HWt. Somehow I'll stick with the contemporaries of
Dempsey who saw him in the flesh, over the naysayers ninety years later...
Common sense dictates that eyewitness accounts trumps the detractors of Jack Dempsey, ninety years later...

 

Mc, respectfully, I have never brought up the fact that ole Archie Moore was floored "9" times in his career. I didn't even know that fact...So in closing I have the greatest admiration for Archie Moore as a great LH, and as a gentleman of distinction...
And I have the utmost confidence that the prime Jack Dempsey had certain qualities as a heavyweight, namely great speed, power , and primal viciousness along with toughness never seen before or since...And one other thing Mc, after he retired he was beloved by everyone as a gentleman
and as the CHAMP...I loved Dempsey and Louis as much for their modesty, as their great feats inside the ropes...Cheers...

 

Now lets not get carry away here, it was a good shot, ans it drop Marciano(who was standing on one foot when the punch landed atsch)

But almost knock him out?? Rocky was down and up in a flash, and was no were near of being close of being knockout. He was as close of being knock out as Ali was vs Fraizer in round 15, or Louis getting drop by 2 Ton Toney. Yeah the punchings hurt said fighters, but they got up before the count of 4 in most cases.

 

Lets not forget that Tommy Loughran was handling Dempsey in sparring in 1926 in the lead up to the first fight. Dempsey was over the hill, I would highly favor Moore with hide sight. Prime Dempsey is other matter. But Dempsey was only good for the first 5 or so rounds if that. He no longer had the legs to fight 15 rounds as boxing's best jack Dempsey video mention.

 

That's part of the unknown allure with the fight. I think he can because he won't get hit completely clean on his chin (Not to say he won't get hit). But this is a big part of the fight. For instance, if Moore gets Dempsey the way he did Marciano maybe Dempsey doesn't get up. Either man is certainly capable of winning.

I have to imagine Dempsey would have more respect and be more refined than that Dempsey.

A good point. Tunney had the superior speed to land that shot cleanly on the chin in his defense.

I don't imagine the Moore fight will resemble anything like this mess and if it does, I somehow still think Dempsey would emerge victorious.

Really wished we had film of this one.

Would really put a dent in the some of these Dempsey fanatics that mythologize his greatness.

Could you link me to that thread. Always thought Dempsey chin was rather overrated but this is rather lengthy exposing if there are examples of Dempsey being downed more than whats been mentioned in your post...

 

Fair enough. He did get up quickly.

 

Maybe Dempsey was too past it.

I still think he could get the rematch or something. He could go 0-2. It's more likely he goes 1-1 than 2-0 against Moore at this stage.

 

He had plenty of slick moves in his upperbody to avoid Old Jack, not to mention Moore could take Jack out with his own punches. Dempsey was old, slow, and easily hittable

 

A later stoppage, or rather, a less dramatic one, as Moore would have something to remember from the first fight..and Dempsey would have that confidence that he ko'ed Arch once before..a 7th-8th round 1 punch stoppage in the first fight...and a 9th or 10th round tko in the rematch.

 

Nice points. :good

A valid point, but Sharkey landed plenty of clean blows with ease.

I actually agree that trading bombs heavily favours Dempsey, but he might get put on his ass.

One can dream!

Sorry I don't remember whereabouts McGrain explained those other instances of Dempsey being downed (ones which aren't listed on Boxrec), but hopefully as a very active member of this board he'll see these posts & add his valuable input.

 

1927 Jack Dempsey beats a Prime Archie Moore 2x? Righttt


Archie Moore-Gene Tunney is a 50-50 fight

 

For all the physical and stylistic reasons I mentioned..so stuff that in your pipe and smoke it..:bbb

 

:verysadYou're wrong about that too.