Rewatch Fury - Wilder 1, scoring and details inside

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by lordlosh, May 30, 2021.

  1. lordlosh

    lordlosh Boxing Addict Full Member

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    So we should say that Wilder is somehow of a incredible defensive fighter, cause Fury misses insane amount of punches as well.
    And should i even mention that 90% of Fury punches was just an arm punch.
    As for round 7 i can't call the situation you mention, before watching it again(which i won't do, cause i lost already enough time re-watching certain round to argue), but i score that round for Fury. So i obviously reward him for something, right?
    As far as that you cannot counter every single punch, yeah of course that is obvious. Should i even write that, so to get what i mean with my words?
    But after Wilder was throwing wide, they end up in a clinch. There was way too many situation where Fury make Wilder miss, and let him get away, cause he was clowning around.
    Now will give you another example - Usyk. He make you miss, and he made you pay for it. He is in a such distance to lure punches, dodge/etc and counter you straight away.

    Sorry but again i don't see why should i reward you for clowning around, and dodging, or barely dodging punches, and yet doing nothing in exchange.
    Actually Wilder was the fighter that push on the attack, after every Fury successful attack.
    For me Fury was way too inactive, as i said.
    And yeah there was some shots that Fury manage to weave, but Wilder still connects on the Fury side or back of the head. But it was not as Wilder was targeting that area, but because of Fury not dodging them completely.

    As far as Compubox goes, its a garbage, that is probably easily manipulated, and score punches that was obviously or partially blocked. You can't make your mind from it at the very least.

    And yeah watching it live, and watch it on later with the ability to rewind it back, put in slow-motion and so its very different thing.
    On some occasion i going back for like 3-4 times to see if the shot actually land or not.
     
  2. bandeedo

    bandeedo Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    i agree with you, losh. and i dont think a whole lot of either one. guys here like to live in a world that is reality by vote, and everyones vote is equal. throw in a bucket of fanboys, and you get all kinds of versions of reality.
     
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  3. Finkel

    Finkel Active Member Full Member

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    I'm not sure it matters as to why you awarded Fury round 7. You made a statement directly to me that Fury didn't land a counter until Wilder went wild after the KD in the 9th round. I pointed out you were being hyperbolic, and gave RD7 as example to show why this was the case. I only know it because BoxingForum24 asked me to look at that specific round, yesterday, and he gave a similar punch breakdown as to what you did for Round 3 in this thread. I'm not asking anyone to re-watch specific rounds.

    Regarding clowning. I never mentioned it. A lot of this feels like you are rehashing old arguments you have had with other people. Sure it might disrupt your opponent and hype a drunk crowd, but it shouldn't have any bearing on the scoring of the round either way. For or against. Not for me personally.

    We obviously have different views on what constitutes good defence. My first two posts in our conversations already address what I think is good defence. Yours is a narrower definition than mine it seems when it comes to scoring. That is fine.

    Regarding arm punches. If Fury lands an arm punch, I would probably weigh it against the quality and quantity of punches landed by Wilder in the same round. I think we both realize not every punch is thrown with the intention of doing damage. This might not be your intent, but the consistency of your arguments seem to be equating swinging full force into mid-air, with probing a guard with lighter punches. Again, maybe that is not your intention, but that's how it comes across. Especially as an explanation equating just how often and badly Wilder was missing, by saying Fury missed a lot too. Again this ties into my thoughts as previously stated on what is effective aggression and what is good defence.

    For me personally, whilst I respect the effort you went to, your punch reports are quite a dry read in terms of why I watch boxing.
     
    Last edited: May 31, 2021
  4. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    It's nice you actually watched the whole fight, scored it yourself and made up your own mind ... (even though it took you three years) LOL

    Watching a fight in its entirety before giving an opinion should be mandatory on this board.

    I'm always surprised how so many people on this board will argue endlessly about a fight or fighter, and in another thread will admit they never saw this fight or that fight or only saw clips of a certain fighter .... and those are the fights or fighters I was debating them about and they were insulting me because I didn't agree with them ...

    AND THEY NEVER EVEN SAW THE FIGHTS THEY ARGUED ABOUT.

    The first Wilder-Fury fight was as close as it gets. Wilder floored Fury twice and successfully defended his title that night. He should get more respect for doing so. People who flippantly say Fury won every round he didn't get dropped in sound like morons to people who actually watched the fight.
     
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  5. kiwi_boxer

    kiwi_boxer "Who cares what's corrupt." - Shadow111 / IsaL Full Member

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    I'm always surprised at the extent you will go to convince people that Wilder is the 2nd coming of christ.

    You Shadow and IsaL should watch fights together. In an asylum.
     
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  6. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    How did you score it? I don't recall if I ever actually saw you post your score.
     
  7. Dubblechin

    Dubblechin Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    That night, I had Fury winning more rounds, but with the knockdowns, the draw was fine. I was suprised Wilder didn't get the win, after the second knockdown. I haven't written down or kept track of my scorecards for decades. I thoroughly enjoyed the fight. I was happy they both did well. They are two of my favorite heavyweights. Total opposites, though. (LOL)
     
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  8. Rumsfeld

    Rumsfeld Moderator Staff Member

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    Fair enough. Do you remember if you had it a draw? 113-113?

    I thoroughly enjoyed it too, and at the conclusion I likewise had a feeling that Wilder would be awarded the decision. But I actually scored it 116-110 for Fury, and while several of the rounds were certainly close, my impression was Fury was doing (at least) a little more in each and every round, and legit deserved to win these rounds.
     
  9. Vegan Beast

    Vegan Beast Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I gave Wilder round 2 because nothing much happened in the round until Wilder landed late. Besides that round and the rounds he scored knockdowns in, I fail to see another round you can make a strong case for wilder winning. All the other rounds had fury doing the best work, making wilder miss and landing most of the best shots.

    All of the other rounds I had Fury just taking it or winning considerably.
     
  10. Vegan Beast

    Vegan Beast Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I had it 115-111 Fury.
     
  11. lordlosh

    lordlosh Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The main problem here is people are catching for every word, and don't get the overall sense of the meaning.
    But i was probably right, when we are talking about the 7th round of the fight, lol. :D
    Yeah there was probably 1 or 2 moments where not just Fury, but both of them counter when the opponent attack, but thats not the point, and you know it.
    I think i have made my point quite clearly. Fury was way too inactive, and he was happy with whats going on. He wasn't throwing enough, and was also missing enough, and not putting much effort. He also failed to make Wilder pay for his misses.
    Just standing in there, moving around, and dodging punches are not going to get you rounds.
    It ain't hard to look at what Usyk did, if you not know what i mean.
    Fury was like Hughie Fury in the Parker fight. Oh robbery for slipping punches and do nothing outside of that, but clowning around ....

    And i don't think you understand what i mean with the things i mention for 20th time already when i`m talking about defense or aggression.
    What i mean was that in order to separate a certain close round for example and to use lets said the guy X is rewarded this round, cause of his great defense in a meaning, he make the opponent miss and then make him pay. Its the same for the aggression type of reward.
    But my view was it was too little, and not obvious enough if i can say it that way, to reward a certain round to either x or y fighter, and that's why i goes with even rounds or given a certain round to x or y fighter.

    As far as Fury arm punches i didn't separate or give Wilder rounds, because of this factor. Let me explain more what i mean with this.
    If we have a similar punches from both fight, or lets said a fighter X land 10 hard full force jabs, but a fighter Y lands 13-14 lets call it light arm punches i will probably give the round to fighter X, if that is what separate them.
    But this was not the case with Fury - Wilder fight. While Fury arm punches may have not been full force, they obviously have affect on Wilder, and his face was telling that. :D You would agree that a lot of factors varies here, as if punch is just a slight touching, if its an arm punch, but a full force landed, if its partially blocked and so on.

    Still i got no problem with your opinion or view, or that you think that Fury has won fair and square. You are definitely a respectable writer.
    At the end of the day its about opinion.
    With what i have problem tho is people catching for a few words totally out of the context or calling me bias, before even checking my post history, and that i never ever favor either of this fighters, and i pretty much never show any bias in scoring or judging a fighter skill for example, no matter if i like him or not.
    To end this thing for good, as i already stated my arguments. Fury show that he is the better boxer in fight 2. Because he understand what he have done wrong, he acknowledge Wilder weakness, and they made a great strategy/tactic to how the approach the second fight and how to get the win. And there was a zero question in it(what i mean is all Wilder b.c. excuses).
    And what Wilder show in the second fight is that he is one trick pony, that he didn't learn, he doesn't have any actual plan how to fight, and what to do if things are not going his way, and that all he has is his right hand, that is severely overrated on here.

    English is not my native, and sometimes i may not use the correct terms or form or so.
     
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  12. lordlosh

    lordlosh Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I agree with your assessment about the round 2. And this was the reason i gave Wilder the 2, the almost last second right hand that clearly land on Fury head.
    And i find it funny people giving round 2 to Fury, but for what exactly? What he did in that round? Wilder definitely stole that round with that right hand, that land cleanly on Fury head. Whoever think that shot misses, should have put it on 0.5 speed and its clearly see the punch landed cleanly.
     
  13. seansanashee

    seansanashee Boxing Addict Full Member

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    It's a very long post and I'm sure you made some good points but there's no need to rewatch or read your long story to know that a fat Fury clowned Wilder.
     
  14. Vegan Beast

    Vegan Beast Well-Known Member Full Member

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    I agree some of the earlier rounds were close, but I think Fury did enough to take most of the because of how much Wilder obviously missed his power punches, and fury landed better jabs and more impressive combinations.
     
  15. iii

    iii Boxing Addict Full Member

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    More like he is suffering from scotoma....