Ricardo Lopez not enough credit

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by dogcatcher, Mar 28, 2012.

  1. dogcatcher

    dogcatcher Active Member Full Member

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    At 51-0-1 Ricardo Lopez isn't talked about much. My guess is people undervalue lighter fighters, and he waas in the lowest division. After watching a few fights he seemed to be a damn good fighter. Where does he rank amongst ATG's?
     
  2. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Boxing Addict Full Member

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    i tend to rate lopez WAAAAY higher than most. on film, he's among the most perfect fighters you'll see. balance, positioning and timing were top notch. he had more than respectable power, hand speed and his chin seemed solid. he was one of the great ring general of the last 30 years. his uppercut was truly a thing of beauty. the only knocks are his lack of in-fighting, which may be seen as a testimony to his ability to control to distance and flow of the fight to favour his style, and his resume which lacks truly great names. The only real fights of note that could have occured, gonzalez and carbajal, did not and would have added to necessary names on his ledger for greatness if he had won.
     
  3. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Boxing Addict Full Member

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    (waiting for someone to say that Chang beats him...)
     
  4. Flo_Raiden

    Flo_Raiden Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Lopez does get mentioned a couple times in a lot of forums. He's my all time favorite fighter but I think most would agree that despite his ATG skills he still falls short because of the lack of meaningful opponents. I do think people seem to overrate him in a P4P sense (hell I've seen people rate him around Top 10 greatest).
    He's still one of the greatest fighters to come out of Mexico. Probably one of the most elegant, well rounded, and perfect fighter you'll ever see on film IMO. He's the best fighter to study from.
     
  5. Boxed Ears

    Boxed Ears this my daddy's account (RIP daddy) Full Member

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    9/10, when I read about him on here, it's people saying he's overrated. Which makes me think he's not.

    Contrarily, 7/10, when I read about Ezzard Charles, it's people saying he's underrated. This makes me think he's not so much.

    Of course, 8.9/10, when I list fractions or percentages, I'm just pulling numbers out of my ass. :conf
     
  6. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    Lopez is still way OVERRATED. Great fighter to watch and did everything right to facilitate his style (little inside game but that didn't matter as he was bigger than everyone else and great at his range) and was of course a picture perfect puncher, but he's one of those guys that get his opponents bogged up because they had to be.

    "Hey, his straw defences had a combined record of 1000-5." Yeah, because they were also fighting stiffs.

    He had the frame and ability to move up. Unlike Monzon or Hagler, his division is too historically weak to lend him much kudos for dominating it. Regardless of why the fights with Chiquita and Carbajal didn't happen, I can't give him credit for 'ifs and buts'.

    Brilliant fighter, not great at all. Not even a great lower weight fighter, not in terms of matching up all the highest achievers from Straw to Fly anyway, not IMO anyway.

    H2H you'd think he was right up there, and while I'd favour him against many, he didn't beat a high enough calibre of fighter for me to see him as this demi-God character like many do. I don't let his beautiful composite punching and dominance pollute my head and get that mixed up with 'great'.

    He gets way more kudos than say, Herrera and Chucho, who are just as impressive fighters against the very best opposition and proved more in their careers. I'd rank him behind them for sure, and even behind Juan Manuel Marquez, who is essentially Lopez with bigger balls. So, nowhere near my top 10 Mexican fighters, and I've loved Lopez since the first time I watched him.
     
  7. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    There are plenty on here that love lower weight guys that would agree he was a special fighter. There are just others that were also special and stepped it up that much more.

    Nightcrawler is referencing a long-standing debate, but Jung-Koo Chang certainly deserves more praise and respect and gets fair less air time than Lopez does. Peeps on the General forum think Lopez is one of the G.O.A.Ts, 'nuff said :good
     
  8. lora

    lora Fighting Zapata Full Member

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    He does get plenty credit on here imo.Even his harsher detractors tend to recognise him as an excellent fighter and talent.His longevity and dedication are never really disputed.

    Things have changed a lot since the late 90s\early-mid 2000's forums though, when he was a general\current scene contrarian's obligatory go-to fighter and offering the slightest bit of constructive criticism against him wouldn't go down well.
     
  9. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Boxing Addict Full Member

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    flea, as always this and your previous post are bang on. a nice counter balance to my (unapologetic!) lopez love. chang is a fighter that i had to look into and respect due to the h2h debates between he and lopez. the more chang you watch, the less chance lopez has frankly
     
  10. Nightcrawler

    Nightcrawler Boxing Addict Full Member

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    only two minor disagreements: i think he's great (at his weight) personally and should be in consideration (not a lock) for top 10 mexican spot.

    also, a bit confused by the bogged up statement in the opening paragraph. what do you mean by that?
     
  11. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    bIgged up. It's a grammatical mess anyway, my apologies :gold

    What I meant is that instead of saying 'Lopez beat so-and-so' his biggest fans chuck all kinds of information at you to make his opposition appear more relevant than they were. For me it's academic as the division is nothing. Nothing, even the Thai's that have fought there ;-)

    As for top ten, he probably is of you're unsure whether to have Casanova, Zurita or Arizmendi rounding out the top ten. I'm assuming the 'locks' are (no order) Chavez, Sanchez, Canto, Saldivar, Olivares, Zarate, Barrera. Have I forgotten anyone?

    Then you've got Morales, Herrera, Chucho, Azteca, Casanova, Zurita, Arizmendi, Marquez, Lopez...depending on criteria I can see him outside the top 10. Taking out those we have very scant footage of, I can still see him behind Morales and Marquez (easily in fact) and certainly have him below Herrera and Castillo. Just my opinion, I just don't think he's as great a Mexican as some make him out to be.

    Again, it's not what Lopez did 'wrong'. Just that those guys did a lot more 'right' in terms of establishing their 'greatness', it's all subjective bollocks anyway, let's be honest :lol:
    Thanks for the kudos by the way :good
     
  12. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    How would y'all rank these? (opinions PLEASE)

    Macias
    Rodolfo Martinez
    Pintor
    Cuevas
    Palomino
    Chiquita Gonzalez
    Jose Luis Castillo
    Sugar Ramos

    EDIT: How many of these could conceivably be ranked over Lopez in your opinion, gents? :think
     
  13. Lester1583

    Lester1583 Can you hear this? Full Member

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    Barrera is a "lock" but Morales and Marquez aren't?

    True.
     
  14. Flea Man

    Flea Man มวยสากล Full Member

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    I think Barrera got the better of the series with Morales. Most seem to agree, so Morales' fate is in the hands of the rest of you guys, how highly you rate the Pacqiuao win, and same for Marquez, how you see his late career run at 135 and how you score the Pacman fights.

    I was going on a 'who do most people consider a lock' and 'what names usually come up in top ten Mexican lists'. Barrera and Morales make my top ten. Marquez is still competing in defining fights, not certain how I rank him until he's ****ed off for a bit and given me time to settle. I'm already certain I'd rank him in the top bracket of the 'possibles' and certainly above Lopez.
     
  15. Lester1583

    Lester1583 Can you hear this? Full Member

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    True.

    Very good win.

    Especially considering Morales was past prime and above his best weight.

    Marquez definetely won the last fight.

    Which is a great achievement.

    Considering
    Pac being P4P¹1,
    Marquez fighting above his natural weight,
    Marquez being well past his prime.

    Great win.

    :good