[RING, Sept. 1965] Walcott insists Ali would beat Dempsey, Louis, Rocky, etc.

Foreman legacy confuses me. Much of his ATG status is what he did in his 2nd career winning the title at 45. Was he considered ATG after his 1st career or was that later on?

 

We have to give Walcott credit for being one of the first to see what was right in front of everybody's face, regarding the potential of Mr Clay.

On the flip side of the coin, he was rightly being criticized for his officiating in the second Clay Liston fight, and that might have led him to play up the argument a bit.

 

A devils advocate, might suggest that he had just participated in the single biggest fraud in boxing history, and needed to come up with some sort of an explanation?

If Liston took a dive, then he was likely involved!

 

ALi had an inch in height and a few inches in reach on Louis .. he had four inches in height and five or six inches in reach over Frazier and had three fights for his life .. I think Joe W was fishtail talking ..

 

He also had Ali's height wrong .. he was not 6' 4" ..

 

Right, & I wonder if he would have thought a ton of later fighers better than ALi mostly because of size & muscle.

Ali had some power, & all the attributes Walcott described.
First time I heard it said that the ringkeeper told Joe it was over before Fleisher.

I do not think it was fixed at all.
Just that Ali got into Liston's head, as did the death threats, & he knew he would take a big beating that he was unwilling to do.

I think Ali would be favored over everyone previous to him.
And maybe everyone afterwards-unless at the top level, size would be decisive after all.

 

JJW is just another modernist fan boy!

 

Rocky about Ali "He could have been most popular if he had Joe Louis attitude" would that attitude be by following the same commandments that Louis managers insisted he followed, of basically being the white man’s ideal black man, not gloating over fallen opponents etc or to put it another way not be another Jack Johnson.

 

Joe Louis represented the older, middle class, upwardly mobile black person while Ali represented the younger, radical black person, politically I mean . Louis attitude was more representative of his generation. When Louis became champion, he got letters from black people telling him that they hoped he would be a "dignified champion" unlike Johnson.

 

Of the fighters he mentioned Dempsey could give Ali trouble, I've always thought Ali would have crucified Marciano

 

Indeed so, Louis was moulded and marketed by 2 coloured managers who knew 'which way was up' and Louis accepted their wisdom.

My comment in previous post was in response to Marcianos comment, maybe Mr Marciano had memories in his head of his last opponent, a certain coloured gentleman called Mr Archie Moore who was not a shy retiring non publicity seeker.
“Wanted: Reward for Capture and Delivery of Rocky Marciano to Any Ring in the World for the Purpose of Defending His Heavyweight Championship Against the LOGICAL contender ARCHIE MOORE. Reward: the Boxing Public Will See a Great Fight and Witness the Crowning of a New Champion. Advise (Sheriff) Archie Moore.”

 

Not saying Walcott is wrong here, but I get the feeling we could apply the same logic when forming arguments about Lewis beating Ali, which is by no means ridiculous idea to entertain.

 

That's true, I latched onto the size aspect way to much.