RJJ Vs George Foreman

Calzaghe posed problems for him yes, but he didn't have his number at all. Nobody beats prime Roy.
And Holyfield also didn't have Tyson's number, he just faced a poor version of Tyson that had lost his discipline and had a downgraded skillset, no longer possessing his amazing defense and head movement and only being a head hunter waiting for that one big shot.

Roy wins every single time.

Perhaps he was, but he wasn't running from Foreman, was he ?
He also was nowhere near Roy in terms of speed and reflexes.

And yet he wasn't a defensive boxer.
He used his bobbing up and down in order to get in close and land.
He was always coming forward, yet that style is disastrous against Foreman.

Foreman ain't catching RJJ in a million years, he ain't got the speed.
Their fight would resemble Foreman's fight with Young, Foreman had huge trouble.
Foreman needs to wait for Roy to get tired.

RJJ is superior to 74 Ali in every possible way, p4p of course.
74 Ali no longer had the same speed, reflexes and stamina as he did in the 60s. Also, he faced Foreman in the blazing heat of Zaire. After round 1, Ali realized he's gonna get exhausted trying to run away from Foreman all night, so he switched tactics and decided to let Foreman exhaust himself out.
Prime RJJ had way more speed and stamina than 74 Ali, he'll have no problems running away from Foreman in the first half of the fight.

Not in a million years.
RJJ runs circles around him in the first 6-7 rounds. Only after he gets tired and Foreman lands some body shots, the tide of the fight is gonna change. Then Foreman most likely lands a body shot that puts Roy down. If somehow Roy gets up, Foreman lands a hook and only after that it's over.

 

Oh well good luck getting past a much taller cross armed defensive tank. Just zipping around throwing jabs and flurries isn't going to cut it. Roy will have a hard time landing a single convincing blow. Foreman blocked many of Hoylfield's machine gun blows, even some of the impressive 12 punch combination he threw. Obviously Hoylfield wasn't as fast Roy, but he was pretty quick and threw with sharp accuracy.

The very instant Roy plants his feet, hell have to move again. A jab from Foreman would send him across the damn ring, and he better pray he doesn't get nailed by any bombs. At some point Foreman lands something big and Roy would be on the canvas longer than the average game of thrones episode.

 

Agreed, But could Roy Jones Jr beat 1988 Mike Tyson? Jones defeated John Ruiz at heavyweight, just curious on your take.

 

Stewart threw and landed far more than Morrison, no way would Roy take those amout of chances.

 

WTF?! I don`t know if Jones could have beaten 1988 Spinks.

 

Jones never faced a jab like Foreman`s, getting around Foreman`s out-stretched posting arms and reaching up to hit him at 6`3 would be impossiblle, Foreman would destroy Jones body.

 

Of course not. In the same way he would not beat prime Ali, or prime Lewis, or Holyfield, or Bowe, etc. They are too good, too big and too strong for him. But he could beat some lesser HWs, some old timers, HWs that were not as big, strong and skilled.

 

I agree, Foreman would destroy Roy's body, but in order to do that, Foreman would need to actually be able to land on Roy's body.
And for the first few rounds, when Roy is fresh, Foreman won't be able to. Sure, Roy won't do much either, cause he'd mostly run and rarely try to land something out of fear of being tagged, but at least he'd survive.
Like I said to CrouchStanceBoxing, Foreman needs to wait for Roy to get tired first. Roy will use way more energy to evade Foreman than he would to evade someone his own size. And that is cause Roy will be weary of Foreman's power.
After 6-7 rounds, Roy starts to get tired. Foreman finally lands some glancing blows, those do damage and slow down Roy even more.
In 2 or 3 more rounds, Foreman finally catches him clean and it's all over.

 

Roy always got on the ropes and the body is a bigger target and very hard to keep out of harms way.

 

Calzaghe would always beat RJJ like Tyson would beat Spinks or Ali would Liston.
Antonio Traver and Griffith beat prime Roy Johns Junior.Griffin was winning the fight until DQ and Calzaghe is twice better than bum Griffin and Traver.

Excuses.
Holyfield was older than Tyson, came after surgery and was in bad shape for Tyson fight.
Holyfield destroyed two guys Tyson struggled to beat in late 80s and yes he would beat any version of Tyson.
Holyfield was more past his best than TYSON but still fought everyone and gave Lewis better fight than Tyson.

Nope, Roy struggled to beat Griffin and Traver and Calzaghe is way better than them.

He was trying to outbox Foreman.He was bigger, stronger and as skillful as RJJ with better stamina.
Ken Norton is one of the best at defense from punches even better than RJJ.His cross guard is unmatched.
He has descent speed and maybe close to RJJ power but he had reach,height,weight,chin,stamina...better than RJJ in every department.

You did not watch the second fight where Frazier boxed backwards against Foreman and Foreman still destroyed him and RJJ is not close in anything to JOE Frazier.
He fought forward and he was bigger and stronger than RJJ.

FOREMAN would destroy RJJ faster than he did Frazier no matter what he tries he could not hide from Foreman who would cut ring easy against that small guy.
Foreman did not need speed to catch you with uppercut you maybe do not know that do you?
Jimmy Young was bigger and stronger than Jones.He fought Lyle and Shavers who would kill RJJ who is just too small for them.
Foreman is not Calzaghe and would kill RJJ no matter how skillful he is because size and power difference is too much.That is like saying Hagler would beat Joe Louis or Canelo would beat Tyson which is insane.

RJJ is not superior in anything but hyping himself.
Ali was faster than him,stronger,better chin...better p4p too.Can you think RJJ with dementia would last full rounds in his 40s against Canelo like Ali did against Holmes?
Not a chance.

Stamina?When did RJJ went 15 rounds?Never.
Ali had more 12 rounds than RJJ and he had 15 rounds which RJJ never faced and how he is better in stamina are you insane?
Ali is twice bigger man than RJJ with one of the best chins in boxing history and RJJ is just a mw with medicore chin at best and no power.
Foreman would kill him.

RJJ was good, but he avoided the Big Punchers of his time. when he moved up he got KTFO. his ‘Fanboys’ think him beating Ruiz was some immortal feat. but Ruiz was one of the weakest HW Champions ever!
I pick Mugabi,Gerard and many others to knock him out in mid rounds and they are not 10 percent of Foreman in size,strenght and power.

 

Nope.

Tarver never fought a prime Roy.
And Griffin stood no chance as Roy proved in their rematch. Griffin was also lucky Roy got DQ'd in their first fight.

FACTS, not excuses. Holyfield being older is irrelevant. He was as skilled as ever, he had honed those skills against the very best. He was match sharp and stronger than ever due to being roided to the gills.
Tyson was no longer as skilled as he was in the 80s. He was just a head hunter with poor defense. And had only fought a grand total of 8 rounds before facing Holyfield, he was not as match sharp.
Prime vs prime, Tyson KO's him.

Of course he was bigger and stronger, that's normal, he's a natural HW.
But he was nowhere near as skillful, no HW is. The smaller weight classes possess far more skillful boxers than the HW division.
And never in a million years did Norton have better stamina than Jones, that's ludicrous.

GTFOH with your bullsh.it.
Roy's speed and reflexes made him almost impossible to tag clean with big punches.

RJJ is lightyears in front when it comes to speed.
And how can you say Norton doesn't hit as hard as Roy ?!? That's the dumbest **** anyone has ever written on this forum.
Norton hit harder, he's a ****ing HW. And like I said, it's logical he was bigger and stronger and with a better reach.
But he's nowhere near as fast, as skilled or has the same stamina.

Frazier was completely washed up by the time they fought the second time, and completely blind in one eye.
He also had worse stamina, speed and reflexes.
And he did not run or moved the way Roy would.

No he ain't, p4p Roy's a lot better.

Yes, Frazier did come forward, and yes, he was bigger and stronger, but that don't mean ****. The key to troubling Foreman or beating him ain't to come forward like an idiot, but to out-box him, you need speed for that, and Frazier is nowhere near Roy in that department.
And Roy won't be stupid to come forward.

Foreman doesn't catch a fresh Roy in a million years, he's too ****ing SLOW.

Yes he does need speed you dummy. Do you really expect Roy to simply stand there and let Foreman tag him ?!?

What Young did vs Lyle and Shavers is irrelevant, when will you learn that ?!????????????

Yes, Foreman would kill him, but in order to do that, he needs to catch him, and he ain't ever doing it in a million years in the first few rounds when Roy is fresh. He can catch him in the second half of the fight, but not in the first.

No it ain't cause I never said Roy beats him, I just said it will take a while for Foreman to win

Yes he is. He's faster, with better reflexes and he hits harder. p4p of course.

Ali was not faster, nor was he better p4p.
Ali was just stronger and with a better chin, but that's just normal given that he's a HW.

Your statement is moronic. It's ****ing irrelevant what Roy would do in his 40s, we are comparing prime vs prime here.
And fyi, Holmes took it easy on Ali and did not want to hurt him, he could have KOd him any time he wanted to.

He doesn't need to go 15 rounds, this will only be a 12 round fight.
And he never did, cause they did not have 15 round matches in his era.

Cause he wasn't as capable at finishing his opponents earlier, while Roy was.

RJJ was the best of his era by a mile, he avoided no one. He simply did what most boxers do, took on the matches that made him the most money.

No, he got KO'd only when he got old and lost his speed.

It's no immortal feat as Ruiz isn't an ATG HW champ, but still it was pretty impressive.

Like I said, he's no ATG, but there have been far more champions that are weaker than him. Braddock is a great example.

Roy will make Mugabi looks like a joke, he'd outland him at will.
McLellan might beat him, but Roy is still favorite.

 

Griffin was out-boxing Roy until he got hurt however he did get destroyed in the rematch, Tyson would always beat Spinks.

 

That’s a funny anecdote Vic.

Jones’ excellent performance vs Ruiz can be most certainly celebrated in its own right - but the extrapolations into other HW successes are a bit of a reach - just imo, of course.

Don’t worry, I’ve been there numerous times - Old Heads had a matter of fact way of cutting down the more exuberant younger versions of ourselves.

You might’ve thought - “Sure, cynical old(er) man” - only later, perhaps, coming to realise - “Damn, the old dude knew what he was talking about!”

Euphoria, however it comes, is a nice emotional conditional to arrive at - I felt same when Ray Leonard beat Hagler - no bias aside from rooting for Ray as the underdog. I rooted for Duran when he fight Ray in Montreal.

I’m a “swinging” fan, so to speak. Lol.

 

Yes, he would.

Traver fought a prime RJJ in his last prime years.
Griffin still gave him helluva fight in rematch and in first fight he won.
Official Judging
Perez 75 - 76
Hassett 77 - 75
Smith 76 - 75
Griffin would won the fight if that did not happened.

They are excuses because Holyifeld was in worse shape than Tyson for that fight yet nobody brags about that like Tyson fans do.
Being older is irrelevant?So prime Foreman or Ali are not good as older versions wtf?
He was past it after all those wars and was losing majority of his fights until Tyson fight happened.Tyson did take roids too even himself admitted that so he is not innocent like you wanna be.
Prime for prime Holyfield knocks him just later rounds.It would be like Douglas fight but even worse than that.

Nothing here is sounding normal because Ali was rated as one of the most skilled boxer ever and is rated higher than RJJ in skills and p4p resume.
Ezzard Charles and Walcott are more skilled than any mw except maybe Sugar Ray Robinson.
Norton did have better stamina than RJJ.Norton went 15 rounds so many times and RJJ was even gassed in 12 rounders and how is he having better stamina than Norton?Only in your dreams.
Norton even have more 12 rounds than RJJ and is proven as better stamina than RJJ.

Oh really?
Then why Calzaghe beat him and bum like Griffin was ahead in scorecards?
Official Judging
Perez 75 - 76
Hassett 77 - 75
Smith 76 - 75

RJJ is not the fastest because even Calzaghe outspeed him in their fight like Griffin did in first fight.

Yes he does.RJJ never went 15 rounds and Norton did that many times and he was scoring knockouts even in late rounds while RJJ struggled to do 12 rounds.

Frazier again would always have better stamina due to better lung capacity unlike RJJ.
How many times RJJ went 15 rounds?Never.
Did he ever scored late KO and holds a record of most thrown punches in a fight?
He was not as skillful and never in a dream has that stamina Frazier had
Roy would move but because his short Reach he cant touch Foreman and Foreman could touch him.

p4p Frazier is on the list of top 10 greatest HWs while Roy Jones in not in top 5 or top 10 middlewieghts of all time.

Only moronic is things you stated as biggest Tysonite who wants to downgrade George Foreman because you can not take the fact that he would beat your hero.
Roy is not durable and was struggling in his last years while Holmes and Ali were winning against best fighters.
And no, Holmes did not take easy on Ali he wanted to beat him and beat him but Ali is so durable that Holmes could not beat him.

And how he is better in stamina than someone who went 15 rounds multiple times and 12 rounds more times than he did?
That is why older fighters did have better stamina than RJJ.

Bigger and better fighters than RJJ tried outboxing Foreman and they failed.

Yeah like he did not catch Holyfield in his later years when he was slower.
Tyson was fast Douglas was slow but he catch him same goes for Patterson and Liston.
Spead means nothings when someone is stronger than you and you have bad chin like RJJ.

Clazgaghe was better at finishing opponents later and outboxing them unlike RJJ who need just one punch to be counted out.

He ducked biggest punchers of his time because he knew that his chin was not his best weapon.
What about ducking Gerald,Benn,Jackson,Nunn and many other good fighters with punch.

He was knocked down by many fighters and was known as chinny fighter.

Tua knocked Ruiz in first round and Foreman is twice the fighter Tua was.

Hagler struggled to beat Mugabi and Hagler would beat Roy JOnes Junior.
He would bully RJJ.
McLellan would kill him so much that would make Calzaghe fight looks funny.

 

He did duck punchers, however Jones was a lot more powerful than Nunn in terms of one punch power, Nunn never stopped a light heavy and his power wasn`t impressive at 168 either.