Rocky Marciano '53 vs. Ron Lyle '75

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Omega74, Jul 20, 2021.

Who wins?

  1. Marciano by KO

    31 vote(s)
    56.4%
  2. Lyle by KO

    21 vote(s)
    38.2%
  3. Marciano by UD

    2 vote(s)
    3.6%
  4. Lyle by UD

    1 vote(s)
    1.8%
  1. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    To be fair, they were much better fighters than Peralta. I don't fancy Peralta fances versus Rocky, he'd break him down quicker than Lyle or Foreman.
     
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  2. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Someone of Moore's caliber? Yes, I can see that happening. Not for a long and it wouldn't change the outcome, but Moore was so tricky he could always find a perfect punch even while being outmatched.
     
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  3. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Archie had an ATG record at HW. Of course it’s relevant. He had no problem beating the big guys at HW or smaller ones. Obviously he doesn’t beat prime versions of Ali Holmes or Tyson but I bet my ass he knocks down everyone of them in their last fights.

    FYI I don’t even like Maxim especially at hw.

    Moore later in his career never easily made LHW limit. It was a struggle.
     
  4. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I would be most willing to put a few thousand bucks on it if only it were possible. I cannot picture Moore, as tricky as he was and still with reasonable pop at heavyweight going close to sitting Holmes down.
     
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  5. 70sFan865

    70sFan865 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Holmes went down quite a few times, usually not against skilled punchers. I wouldn't bet on it, certainly not but I don't think it's impossible.
     
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  6. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Moore absolutely most certainly DID NOT have an ATG record at heavyweight. Besides never winning the title name his 3 best wins.

    As for him knocking down Ali, Holmes or Tyson in their last fights how misleading is that? Marciano left early on as champion of the division while Holmes, Ali and Tyson left as old men and shells or what they once were. It's like comparing Roy Jones Jr's last fight to Carlos Monzon's. Not remotely comparable. Moore would not have knocked down championship versions of those three.

    Well he's not much chop H2H there.

    Well he sure made it well enough to be defending his title against some quality opposition so he wasn't exactly a dead man walking.
     
  7. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Well Shavers was known as having a little bit of pop and Snipes had 25+ pounds on Moore and liked to swing hard.
     
  8. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Moore’s decent HW wins
    Nino x2
    Baker
    Bivins x4
    Lavorante
    Clarence Henry
    Jimmy Slade
    Abel Cestac
    Embrel Davidson
    Charley Norkus
    Notable LHWs he beat with great hw records
    Satterfield
    Harold Johnson x3
    Joey Maxim x?
     
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  9. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    The top end of that record is most ordinary. Anything but a "an ATG record at heavyweight".

    Satterfield, Johnson and Maxim did not have "great hw records". Satterfields was quite ordinary.
     
  10. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Boxing Addict Full Member

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    I’ll give you Maxim (even then some decent wins) but Johnson has one of the best records at HW and we’ve already been through Satterfield scalps despite his losses he was a very dangerous man. A more successful Cooper of his time.

    nothing ordinary about having that many great wins at HW. When most fighters today have one or two good wins against ranked opponents Moore had a crazy amount of wins against ranked prime opponents. Bivins Nino and Baker were excellent contenders as was Henry. The rest were more or less average.
     
  11. roughdiamond

    roughdiamond Ridin' the rails... Full Member

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    I actually think Marciano wins this but some of the logic here is asinine. As always, weird nit-picking, hyper focused resume and size focus and overly long obtuse posts carrying diversionary arguments. This forum seriously needs an ignore thread function.
     
  12. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Realistically when talking the era of Ron Lyle Johnson's not really a heavyweight. Guy's a bonafide light heavyweight who throws on a handful of pounds at the very most. You couldn't depend on Satterfield to win much at all. Ordinary top end wins.

    He doesn't have any "great wins" at heavyweight. None, nada, nil. Wins vs ranked opponents aren't automatically "great". It was a weak undersized era. Marciano was the only heavyweight worth much chop apart from an aging Walcott and Charles. Some won't even rate those three.
     
  13. Gazelle Punch

    Gazelle Punch Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Then we will never agree on this topic. You’re opinion of these decent to great fighters is not in the ball park of my opinion of them (to each their own). Although I’m always for friendly debate.
     
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  14. JohnThomas1

    JohnThomas1 Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yes we are no-where near agreement on the level of this lot.

    Satterfield isn't close to being a top 100 heavyweight so i can't label him as having a "great hw record".
    Valdez might break in.
     
  15. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    woe there pardner! Holyfield by your own admission juiced into a heavyweight “and stayed there”. Yet Moore is penalised because in an earlier era the heavyweight division is poor and “undersized”? Don’t you think advances in science and steroids made fighters oversized? maybe there was a normal limit to what could be achieved before fighters became over stuffed and built up with modern methods. And maybe without that fighters like Moore were closer in size to top heavyweights?

    might be worth you watching Archie against Embrell Davis then.

    I’m sure Davis is nowhere near the quality of Holmes but it is still an example of Archie having a good Heavyweight wallop. He won’t beat Larry, but having a heavyweight wallop must put moore in a similar level of threat to Renaldo Snipes in that department?
     
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