Rocky Marciano has a very good case for #1...

how old were the hall of famers? old enough for pension? pretty close..

 

well if you can be considered no.1 heavy by only beating light heavies then Rocky's your man e.g. beating an old moore that Patterson destroyed but its considered one of rocky's best wins - go figure. talking about the likes of lastarza in the same league as liston, ali or frazier is absurd. those 3 great heavies (liston, foreman, frazier) that ali beat are far greater than any rocky win. did he beat any great heavy who was over 200 pounds?

 

I have chosen to read not a single response in regards to the opening thread, as my opinion may be altered... I have always enjoyed the vids of Marciano fighting and the biographies in my library regarding the man. He remains the greatest fighter of his era... whilst he reigned H/W Champ.

Yes, he demolished a very old Joe Louis.

Yes he demolished a very old Walcott after initially takin the title after 13 rounds.... Ko 1 in the return. Wacott was 38 & 39 years of age in the respective fights.

Yes he destroyed Ezzard Charles, who was a well established man, with a great record at the age of 31 and 33 twice.

Both Charles and Walcott managed to stay the distance, regardless of the offensive attack from Marciano.... Marciano was, with out fail, one of the fittest fighters of his weight, EVER. He trained inceasently, due to fact he was always fighting the flab.

Nothing can be taken away from the Records books... 49-0.(43).. and so it shall remain... FOREVER.

Regardless, its our right to ponder the likely out come of a match with Floyd Patterson. As this was a perfect match up.. A match up which escaped us by the retirement of Marciano 12 months earlier.

The same Marciano kod Moore in 9 round... Patterson took 5 rounds..

This match may have resulted in Marciano`s record not remaining intact..

Age would have become the better of marciano against Patterson.

As for Joe Frazier??? I strongly doubt that Rocky had the ability for a man of his size/weight to withstand the unsurpassed quantities of left hooks Joe landed in any fight....

Its in no way, of myself, an attempt to demean Marciano, but its just a clear observation, as far as Im concerned, that Rocky`s timely retirement created an even greater legacy. Not to mention the state of the H/W division at the time. He did all he had to do, alas, so did Dempsey. Had Dempsey remained far more active, he should have taken Tunney to the cleaners.... "To rest is to rust"... Jacks own terminology. The powers that be, dissuaded the match with Wills. Simple.

I truly believe the Marciano was perfectly managed, with himself an insperation to all fighters. His lack of inactivity was a positive influence on his career, as it remains deteramental to many other careers. His timing was perfect for his reign as H/W Champion, and its difficult to imagine he would have remained unconquered with 2-3 years of inactivity during the reign as Champ. These years away from the ring ensured a lot of rust and re-thinking for many other notables...

He remains a top 10 H/W Champion for sure. Top 5 is difficult for me to place him in... Its my own opinion. Cheers.

 

This is a very good point actually. But both Ali and Louis had beaten more ranked opponents at 32 than Marciano, hadn't they?

 

How does this matter in ranking a fighter?

 

Nah, I meant that Marciano was smaller than "the HWs of the 60s or 70s".

 

Debatable if it does. Actually I think Marciano´s size disadvantage is more of an advantage against many fighters. Marciano was excellent at fighting small, pictuere him in his crouch against Lewis. Lewis would have to bow down to jab Marciano which lead him off-balance.

 

I agree but against Marciano I´m sure he would pay. Against Tyson for example his size disadvantage would hurt Marciano. I think some people make to much out of size differences at hw. The difference there isn´t as important as in the lower weightclasses.

 

liston was undefeated for 10 years before facing Ali. He destroyed Patterson. You think Rocky is going undefeated fighting the likes of Liston, Ali, Frazier, Foreman or Holmes - all great 210 to 225 pound fighters. Frazier lost to 2 greats. Holmes didn't lose til he was 35 years old. Rocky got out at the right time. Credit to him. Maybe Ali shoulda stayed retired in 1967. He woulda remained undefeated but he wouldn't be considered number 1.

 

vicious circle

Well, it would hurt him against some and would give him an advantage over others.