Rocky Marciano vs Riddick Bowe?

At some point, you have to decide whether you believe in physical advantages/disadvantages or not.

You can't be selective on the matter, dependent upon the era.

The elephant in the room, is that Bowe might just be stupid enough to make it an inside fight.

Rocky Marciano never met a man who was willing to let him unload on his chin, at least anywhere close to his prime.

How good was Bowe's chin?

Obviously very good but also a few question marks.

 

The only shop worn guy Rocky fought was Joe Louis, who happened to be still a decent, active contender in his own right at this time. A favourite to beat Rocky no less.

By the time he became champion, Apart from Holyfield, Bowe probably didn’t beat anyone 51’ Joe Louis could also beat.

name them. coetzer, Tubbs, Biggs, Cooper.. these guys were dead men walking or inept at world level to begin with.

Riddicks resume is thin. In relation to all time great fighters His opponents kind of suck. The best guy he beat lost to Michael Moorer...and also holds a win over Bowe anyway.

Even as a young guy Bowe was lazy and sloppy enough to lay on inside and swap punches. But he never fought anyone who hit like Rocky. Forget size, Rocky was a legit hitter. Anyone happy to take two to land one with Rocky is getting carried out. No matter how tall and overweight they are.

 

Are you talking to yourself? Because you were the one speaking in absolute terms claiming no big man ever beats a small man on the inside no matter how skilled. Then you actually entertained the idea of 68' reach Rocky outjabbing Bowe which sounds like a good punch line for an HBO comedy special, pun intended. I'm not being selective, it's factual that Bowe is a special case, he's a big man with good inside fighting skills. Literally millions of people agree.

Literally every Rocky thread it's you, choklab, gazelle punch or someone else blatantly ignoring physical advantages and pretending like they don't believe in them as if it's against your religion.

How would that be "stupid" when he's a good inside fighter himself and he has experience beating smaller men on the inside such as Holyfield whose no slouch himself?

Big difference between "letting" someone unload on you like an adult film star and having leaky defense because you're committed to hitting the other guy back.

Bowe never actually stood there getting hit intentionally he was just sloppy on defense because he was confident his own power would win out in an exchange.

Pretty solid considering he has zero KO losses and less than half a dozen knock downs. At least a 7-8/10 given the sheer length of his career even if he didn't face very many huge hitters.

He did fight Cooper and Hide and I have serious doubts Rocky hits significantly harder than either of them if at all, and both of them had around 20 lbs of muscle over Rocky. Cooper in particular had some similarities to Rocky in size and style being an aggressive granite chinned short armed 5'11 guy with nasty hooks and volume and he got completely demolished.

 

Charles and Walcott had been through the ringer, Moorer too. They still had elite skills but their bodies were very worn from going up multiple weight classes and having been in many wars, including with each other. Walcott and Charles fought 4x with the last one ending in a savage KO. Walcott got stopped many times. All 3 had been in more than 50 fights, Moorer more than 100. We've been over this and so have other posters. You're delusional. I'm sick of having the same arguments with you over and over.

Rocky probably does not hit harder than Cooper and Hide both of whom got steam rolled by Bowe.

And if Bowe leans on Rocky and traded Rocky is getting squished like a wildebeest attempting to lock horns with an elephant.

 

Micheal Moorer matches Bowes best win. They both won and lost to the same guy. Yet You just said Moorer had also been through the ringer by then. So Prime Bowe matches the best of a guy already worn down by hard fights? This logic is clashing with an opinion of Charles and Walcott being worn. The argument you seem to put forward is that Charles and Walcott need ruling out because they are as worn as Moorer was, the guy Bowe can’t overshadow since he lost to the same guy as well!

I think a guy has seriously lost his way in a boxing debate once comparisons are made between zoo animals.

 

I see you added the "decent" because you know very well Wlad has exchanged with a number of opponents, inside and out, he was in a lot fights and it's impossible to always have your way.

By adding "decent" , a vague and highly subjective description, you can refute any example provided with your opinion.

Boring.

 

Let me see Wlad exchange in the pocket with fighters during his prime. Not MID range. Infighting. Lewis did the numerous times

 

So here we are again...

"during his prime" being the subjective, so any example listed would boil down to "well, he wasn't prime."

What is the point of games, man? What does this do for you.

I also don't trust your ability to be objective, given you tried to argue hooks thrown while Wlad is literally body to body with a guy was not "short." Grasping for straws. Why these absolutes you know you can't back up?

Why are "exchanges " even being tacked on now, when we originally were comparing the uppercut and left hook as inside weapons. I showed Wlad being effective on the inside with the hook. Goal post shifting. Argument over.

 

40-50....depending if the Rock comes in at 184 or over 190. I believe the Rock would come in heavy as he did against Big Bill and the Sailor.

 

I hope you're not basing this supposition on the Holyfield fights...

Because of the huge size disparity. Marciano, who is much slower and less technically sound than Holyfield, would have to cross through a lot more of a danger zone (where Bowe can hit him and he can't hit Bowe) every time he sought to get inside on Bowe.

Unlike Marciano, Holyfield had the tools to punish Bowe from range, because of his speed, technique, and counterpunching abilities, which might partly explain why Bowe was content to fight him in close so much.

Bowe's powerful uppercuts and short hooks to the body would be the perfect remedy for Marciano's plodding crouching advances, and his wide, wild inside punches.

And if Marciano got too low for Bowe to engage, he would just lean on him or hold him, and force him to reset.

 

I was talking about Archie Moore being shopworn, not Michael Moorer. I thought that it would be obvious based on context that it was a typo given that I was talking about Rocky opponents.

What would you call quitting? You didn't respond to my last post in the Foreman vs Rocky thread. Concession accepted, and thank God!

 

Because hitting somebody whos not htting back is different from exchanging Wlad didn't get into dog fights when he was under Steward. He did before but he got chin checked 3 times and tailored his style to that of a range boxer. And most of those exchanges were at mid range anyway. Wlad never really exchanged in the pocket. But lets say he did. Lets say im totally wrong. Ok. Lewis did it a hell of a lot more and was more skillful at it

 

The size difference is still enormous even at 40 tbh. Besides Bowe could come in at 240lb, thats the same weight he was when he fought Holyfield for the third time and stopped him. That difference is about 50 pounds

 

It is but Bowe will make things hard for himself. And it’s not like He hasn’t lost to a guy 30 pound lighter.

And be even slower. If you consider what use it might have been to weigh that heavy in the 1950s, before more readily available information in science and nutrition to make any of this weight functional in boxing, it becomes clear what a hindrance it would be against Rocky.

That’s the same weight Riddick was when Holyfield first decked Bowe. Only some weird seizure prevented Evander from finishing the job. Rocky certainly would have demolished a defenceless Bowe that Evander left off the hook. And so would have any decent fighter in that situation. Bowe lucked out here. Evander was not very healthy.

 

Wow you related to the Rock?