Rocky Marciano vs. Sonny Liston

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Satterfield KOed #2 Oma and #3 Baker. Holman may have been ranked as well.

He also injured Valdez's eye and fractured Gomez's ribs in victory to add to his reputation.

And its odd that you are taking this stance when earlier in this very thread you were using this line of logic to critique Moore's claimed power, dismissing his one punch destruction of the much larger Davidson and asking which top HWs he KOed? You can't have it both ways.

Moore and Williams seemed to be equally effective punchers at HW, though Moore was the far more superior fighter overall. They both lacked the signature big KO win over a "top guy", but they blew out the cans and fringe fighters that were there to be hit and were capable of stunning and dropping their better opponents. In their signature TKO wins over Baker/Lavorante and Terrell respectfully, they both dished out severe punishment over the course of the fight that left their outclassed opponent defenseless.

 

What is odd? I was challenged to produce the name of a top ten heavyweight that Williams ko'd. I came up with Roger Rischer.

I then asked if the criteria for being ackowledged as a puncher depended on having top ten rated men on your ko list? And, if that was the case were the following
Satterfield,Gomez,Ruddock,Foster, Morrison, Lyle and several others punchers or not?

Im aware you are critiquing my every word , and now I'm annoyed because I've just trawled through 38 pages and found zero reference from me about Embrell Davidson or Moore's ko of him. Moore is a top all time p4p puncher who said he wasn't?

The only negative reference I made about that was that many of his kos were over middles and lhv'ys do you want to challenge that statement?

I don't believe any of those three Holman,Baker or Oma were rated when Satterfield kod them.
Since I've just gone through 38 pages here, perhaps you would show proof to the contrary and save me looking through several hundred magazines?

 

-Ah, it was the other Marciano vs Liston thread, where you seem to be embracing a similar line of criticism of Moore that Williams is getting hit with in this thread.

[url]http://www.boxingforum24.com/showthread.php?p=15708555#post15708555[/url]

-Sure, I will challenge that. Many of his KOs were over LHW and MW, and a great many were also over HWs. There was no drop off in his KO% above 175, it actually looked to have increased because his HW opponents were not of the same stock as the all time great LHWs he was cycling through. Fighting Maxim, Charles, and Johnson multiple times isn't going to pad your KO stats.

-Baker described as #3 behind LaStarza and Charles.

[url]http://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1915&dat=19530702&id=Lu8gAAAAIBAJ&sjid=xnIFAAAAIBAJ&pg=4346,447107[/url]

-Oma was rated #2 in the Feb 50 issue of Ring Magazine and had been undefeated in 15 fights for 2 years when he was knocked out cold by Satterfield.

 

Richer became a contender after he lost to Big Cat but to Answer your question Archie Moore already KO'd Richer in 1957 so if you are giving Big Cat advanced credit then Archie certainty falls under the same criteria

Satterfield KO'd 32 fight Big Cat prior to him being rated so if we are using your _BIG CAT-Richer-methodology -neither before nor after equals present

As far as Satterfield and without digging too deep look no further then Nino Valdes who Satterfield dominated and had down for a 9 count in the last round and that was mid-1955 Nino was rated in 54-& 55

 

-Great catch. Moore KOed Richer in 4.

-I think a strong case is being made for Moore's power punching being as equally effective as Big Cat's. Moore may not even be that far off from 50 HW KOs himself.

-Satterfield KOed #3 Baker. Which is why the Charles/Satterfield pairing makes sense as an eliminator if Valdez in fact skidded the offer.

 

No, Rischer was ranked when he fought Williams:
[url]http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=VQdLAAAAIBAJ&sjid=CiMNAAAAIBAJ&pg=1214,5593759[/url]

Rischer's loss to Moore six years earlier isn't really relevant. No one's suggesting Moore couldn't punch.

And it's not a question of how many fights Williams had. He was 20 years old and like most men of that age hadn't filled out and gained his full physical strength - he was around 10 pounds lighter than he was in his prime.

 

It has been suggested Moore couldn't punch, at least not as effectively as Big Cat, and that doesn't seem to be the case.

Satterfield destroyed all the tall heavy punchers that made the mistake of trying to recklessly slug it out with him. The Big Cat of the Liston fights would have likely got blasted in 1 or 2 as well.

 

You wanted to know which they kod not who they had down.I don't know what Archie Moore has to do with this really or why I am answering you when I 'd decided it was a waste of time.

 

That is just supposition.

 

Moore was a far better finisher and much more accurate than Satterfield, he was a trap setter Satterfield was a gung ho, early rounds blaster.

 

Yes, and a very sound reasonable one.

We know Satterfield has the power to get the job done, and Williams' total disregard for defense against Liston doesn't give me much hope. He would suffer the same fate as Baker.

 

Satterfield was erratic and lived or died by his power, but all said and done, he carved out a remarkable resume for himself. He has some excellent late round knockouts and decision wins too. Some fights he seemed glass jawed, others he sustained serious punishment.

 

Satterfield was a notoriously heavy duty party hound, that accounts for his erratic form in a lot of fights.Marciano doing the commentary for one of them said, if he would only live right and stay in shape he would be a 100% better.

 

I agree, re watching Liston-Big Cat confirmed he was easy to hit, threw wider type punches, impressive Physical specimen at 6"2 208, looked chiseled & big but he was clearly Ko'd numerous times before the policeman's bullet and afterwards

He had power but no proof that he was an elite puncher by ring combat but most of all he was limited and for the most part easy to hit and failed the chin test against Satterfield Liston and Ali among others

Big Cat was not an effective puncher Billy Daniels & Frankie Daniels were KO'd around the same time they fought Big Cat but they survived him and numerous other opponents that were being KO'd consistently at the time Big Cat failed to KO

so was Big Cat was not effective a puncher nor did he have or good defense and while his chin did not fail him as consistently as Floyds it still failed him

 

They are supposedly making a movie about Satterfield, one of the most exciting fighters to watch, do or die and quite a lot of scalps on his resume, box-rec has him listed at 6'2 but I read an article that he was only 5"10 and standing next to Charles and Layne he looked shorter than both but power can not be denied....he must have been another Ruben Olivares & Duran with the burn the candle at both ends routine because he was erratic