Rocky Marciano vs the 80s heavyweights.

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The whole Tucker just fought to survive has been blown out of proportion.

Heres the highlights of Tyson Tucker. Tucker fought a very smart fight, its just that he was in with someone who was better.

http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=XcHbh5S61qM

 

Tucker lost to the 5"11 70 inch reach Orlin Norris and 5"10 Mike Tyson, I dont see him having a winning fight and surviving Marciano, he could fight a defensive fight and stay the distance.

 

Marciano did not have poor boxing ability. He kept a high guard, he feinted well, moved his head, moved his body in very unorthodox angles in a low crouch, threw combinations, was capable of throwing 100 power punches a round, he rolled his body very well in the crouch, mixed up his punch selection to head and body.

He actually had unbelievable defense during toe to toe brawls, watch round 6 vs moore. Even during toe to toe slug outs, he was still moving his head very well slipping punches.

Marciano possessed a lethal right hand capable of knocking any man out with 1 blow he could throw it short or roundhouse. He developed a good left hook with knockout power. He had an insane punch output when the going got tough, he could throw 100 power punches in round 15 of a war, he mixed his punches well between head body shoulders arms, he punched anywhere and everywhere. He used great leverage and got his whole body into every punch.

People comment on his lack of accuracy, but he sure knocked out a lot of defensive master boxers.

He had a very good chin, he was hardly ever hurt on film, he was incredibly strong. Maybe the strongest 185lber ever.

 

Choklab you are a great poster.

But there is no decent even circumstantial evidence that Tyson used PEDs.
He was a solid 200 lbs. at 13. When poor & gno access to PEDs.
He *never* showed any of the rapid growth when already strong that is so suspicious.

And there is noreal "Evan Fields' type of evidence, anywhere, from anyone.
Tyson was natural.

 

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Lol, Marciano is a defensive master now, is that the reason he was bleeding so much ? One punch KO power? Against old, shop worn bald has beens ? He even got himself knocked down in the process of...

Bruno, Witherspoon, ****ey, Tucker, Bonecrusher, Williams will give him major problems and one thing for sure , he was never ever hit as hard as some of those guys can dish it out. I would compliment if he beats half of those fighters which is not certain...at all.

Prime Holmes gives him a beating of a life time.

Tyson flat out Ko's him, no doubt, in uncompetitve fashion.

This marciano worshiping reminds me of the Pac hype, for YEARS h e would do dis and dat aginst Mayweather but when the actually fought Pac was exposed as the one trick limited pony he is......the same thingwould happen to marciano if a time machine existed.

Now, at Cruiser or Light heavy, yeah, he would be a terror there, no doubt but against modern Heavyweights he is going to be taken out more than he wins.

As a matter of fact, the man had a sense of reality and he would never compete at the Heavyweights today, straight out of a time machine.

 

Regardless, I think Tyson benefited from being a full time job for a whole team of people from 11 years old. Ruthlessly tained into a champion from a child by pretty ruthless/ determined people. he got the best training programme that money could buy. I would not like to say what hat involved. Either he really was a freak of nature (likely he was) or he benefited from intense full time regimes as he grew in a rare way not seen before. If he never juiced he still was a "laboratory experiment" of some description. Not all champions were trained as full time athletes from childhood by expert who had already developed champions.

Besides that, with hindsight, I don't think Tyson beat anybody Marciano or any other great fighter could ave beaten, although I fully accept that at the time I was as excited by his spectacular progress through the ranks as anyone.

If we use Tucker as a yardstick for greatness i think in retrospect it is an injustice to greater feats within the heavyweight division.

 

Indeed. Great qualities to possess. But to overcome a truly special fighter proven greatness itself is required. I just don't see proven greatness in Tony Tucker. Good attributes certainly but greatness? Larry Holmes and Tyson had proven greatness but the likes of Tucker, Carl Williams, Tyrell Biggs or any long heavyweight not called Lewis, Bowe or Kiltchsko need stoppage wins over decent fighters before you could pick them by stoppage over one of the top three ATG champions of the first 70 years of championship history as somebody put it before.

 

Marciano himself said he had to take Louis's jabs
because he could not avoid them ,that is poor defence.

Marciano punched anywhere and everywhere because he was never accurate with his punches it wasn't a plan. He had poor balance and fell over after missing punches, that is not a fighter with good boxing ability. his own trainer said he had two left feet! Marciano knocked out two top drawer defensively adept boxers Moore and Walcott, both were past prime and nearly 40 .
Charles was nailed and stiffened several times by others when younger I wouldn't call him a defensive master

Lastarza's boxing ability is well overated as film demonstrates.. Marciano's one punch power is exaggerated imo You show an old Walcott who was systematically worn down in the first fight and quit in the second.
Layne who was not in top shape being flabby around the midsection,something the newpapers commented on, again he was gradually broken down. Mathews a light heavy .
I in return produce :
Willis Applegate.
Art Henri
Lastarza x2
Lowry x2
Mogard
Donato
Charles
****ell
Moore
Buonvino
At least 4 of these were really light heavies

 

Gerry ****ey would give Marcaino fits.

But they all lose.


Marcaino would be champ again.

 

I've never claimed greatness on Tucker's behalf.
I'll say this, in the decade 1980 -19190 Marciano does not become champion.

 

Or it could just be a very good jab. We have been through this before. I studied that fight to work out exactly how Louis managed this. It was because he employed a step off jab. The advantage of using a step off is you get away but your commited to the mercy of the other man's pace and being too far away to follow up with anything but another step off jab. You can't work off a "step off" jab. Louis exhausted himself finding the room getting away. It was his undoing.

he made every target count. He found the jaw enough times to record knockouts against every world champion of his own era.

he was effective though. The ability to win fights looking bad is something it itself. Jack Johnson, the klitchkos included.

Both were on a career peak both having beat ATG performers in there previous fights. Best signature wins of their careers leading into fights with Rocky.

Charles turned pro as a high school kid. He had not fully matured and recovered from that career during the three years absent from professional boxing during his war service. His durability and boxing ability should only be measured only by his post war career.

Roland looked like a nice boxer on film. He showed more ability losing to Rocky than many other world championship challengers. There have been many worse.

 

I think your off on this one.

Tucker started light on his feet but after the first minute was no more mobile than Old Louis was against Marciano, in fact he is slower with his jab and more predictable in his movements.

Marciano would get under Tucker's jab, go for his body, and we'll end up seeing lots of the same patterns as we did against Tyson, with Tucker having to clinch constantly and getting backed up. If Rocky can push around a solid 213 lb Louis, he can push a lanky 221 lb Tucker.

Tucker certainly went into survival mode at the mid point, and its tough for a small man to find a tall guy doing that. Tyson has some success with the Marciano feint (show jab, right hand), but he slows down a lot in the late rounds and walks in too much looking to jab, though Tucker isn't the type to make him pay for that.

I think Rocky gives Tucker a harder time late in the fight and forces him to work more, but ultimately Marciano probably wins on points just as Tyson did.

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I1a48q5HtlE[/url]

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wXBhbmrCo5M[/url]

 

Your assessment that Tyson was better than Marciano, is reasonable, but I don't see how we could make a case for tucker based on this fight.

We are seeing him getting comprehensively outpointed, by a 5' 10'' pressure fighter, and only landing a handful of clean punches in the entire fight.

Based on this fight, you wouldn't have to be as good as Tyson to beat him.

 

Marcianos so called "Power" would be laughed at by the 80's standards.......there is no fuggin way if you ever have been to a gym that a lightheavy/cruiser like Marciano is punching as hard as true Heavyweights....and his face first style would crack his chin at no time against the real heavy hitters....Brunos jab alone would make him see stars....skinny old timers landed on Marciano and so will full size heavies from the 80's, fact, and no 185 pound attrition puncher is going thru those guys, but the top contenders of that era would all leck their chops to fight the little guy .

 

Tucker would beat the Marciano Louis with his hands tied behind his back...pushing around a shell of a shell bald Grandpa louis is a lot easier than a prime 6'4 225 pounds UNDEFEATED Heavyweight champ in his prime.............marciano does not have the power, foot/handspeed /strengh and boxing ability to put Tucker in a shell like Tyson did, no way no how...and if a coming out of rehab washed up Tucker can get up from Lennox Lewis's right hands and keep on going he is going to laugh at what Marciano is going to throw at him in slow mo.