Rocky Marciano

I guess Richard Dunn, Jurgen Blin, Ruddi Lubbers, Jean Pierre Coopman, Terry Daniels and Ron Stander were all great fighters at the top of the heavyweight division and this is when Ali and Frazier were on the top of there game and in Frazier's case title defences and if you really want to see a fighter who fought even into his 20th-30th and 40th fights guys with horrible losing records check Big George Foreman

 

ike ibeabuchi and david tua were 230-240 and they could fight at a crazy pace i think they both would ko marciano withing 6.

 

:good

 

and you still havent said what big heavys rock has beaten, i would love to see a chris byrd make rocky look amatureish, with all his fake weight. lol

 

First off run through the big heavyweights who made the top ten during Rockys entire career. There are not that many. I can only think of Bob Baker and nino valdes, both were flattened by light heavyweights. Why? Because being big, tall and slow was not an advantage against classic sized heavyweights. It did not make them bad contenders just because smaller guys knocked them TFO. It was normal. superheavyweigts existed, they just did did not feature, maybe in another era where all the division was as enhanced with size and slowed with carrying artificial weight they might have made the ratings. But in Rockys career he did not get credit for knocking over giants like Johny Shkor and Bill Wilson because they could not make an impression on an era of lean fast classic sized heavyweights. Maybe if all shkor and Wilson fought was other blimps they might have looked good. Shkor was a top liner in Boston. Held his own with a lot of talented fighters. Wilson had a big KO run. Marciano knocked out dozens of heavyweights who had giant frames but weighed in less to match the elite fighters of the day. They needed to just to compete! Rex Layne was a bull of a guy who later on would fill out proving he could easily have been 220lb had he wanted to but coming heavy was seen as a burden back then ... because it was!

Ike ibeabuchi and david Tua did not make the grade in their own era. They were not fighting big guys trained down for stamina. They were fighting other body builders.

 

:good

Its true, Joe Louis blew up to 230+ for an exhibition with Nino Valdes who was 6"3 215 and Louis knocked Nino out in the 1st round but when it came to Louis's next fight he dropped 20+ lbs because heavyweights back then trained to make weight and Louis felt his best condition for stamina,speed and reflexes was to stay svelt and fit...with weight training you gain crazy weight with added muscle but does not help your power,stamina, speed especially when you have to be prepared for a 15 round fight

 

exactly, Joe Louis is a prime example of a classic sized heavyweight. A big guy who trained down. As they all did. Superheavyweight is a myth.

 

Find it interesting scrolling on this thread about The Rock; the dispassionate BoxRec, faded articles 'n YouTube perceptions of him. They can't begin to communicate the rhino he was.

 

What happened to Goodnight, Irene? Up until the redundancy and lack of support for his arguments, I was enjoying his shtick.

 

I think he is doing some research...

 

The issue is, even those who could train down to just over 200, still hold a stone advantage. Those bigger like Liston and Ali are 2 stone bigger. The super heavy guys even if they get down 225 they're still 3 stone bigger.

Rocky is up against it when matched with the bigger champs who followed.

 

That's what I was thinking?? He was pretty funny - has he been banned or something? The other day he posted a new thread (can't remember but think it was titled 'say something good about a fighter you usually hate on'? Or something like that) and I thought it would be an interesting thread but then when I clicked on it to reply to it it suddenly disappeared completely along with Irene?? Does anyone know what happened??

 

Try looking beyond offense only of bigger opponents.

The other side of the coin in the bigger is better argument is defense; the bigger guys have more area to cover. And they are bigger targets. Is their defense up to par to sustain that? What about their legs and feet? Guys have to learn how to not get hit. And which big guys fight off their toes for 36 or 45 minutes?

 

Ali came inside 200lb a few times thats only 10-12lb more than Marciano. was the 220lb Ali better than the slimmer version of himself? I dont think so.

Before championship rounds were cut to 12 there wasnt many career 220lb contenders.

Before the gloves in championship fights went from 6oz to 8 then 10 ounce there were not many decent heavyweights over 200lb. With smaller gloves you move around a lot more to avoid getting cut.

Superheavyweight is not a new species of boxer. In most cases its the same sized guys taking off less weight than they used to and another set of even smaller dudes who bulk up more. Heavyweights have always been big men.

 

How much did he weigh against Liston?

The point is the average size of a human has increased over the last 60 years. Not only are people bigger but the better people are also bigger. Just like you wouldn't expect Mayweather to beat Andre Ward, I wouldn't expect Rocky to beat Tyson or those guys who are talented, just belong in a bigger weight class.