As you know, Roland Lastarza was a good boxer but failed to take on the top black contenders of his era, and outside of marciano did not take any of the other great fighters of his era. So in fantasy h2h matchups how do you think Lastarza would have done vs the following men Clarence Henry Nino Valdez Bob Baker Ezzard Charles- 1950-1951 Jersey Joe Walcott- 1950-51 Joe Louis- 1950-51 Archie Moore Harold Johnson Bob Satterfield Hurricane Jackson Earl Walls Its too bad lastarza did not fight any of these guys. I thought viewing film hes a terrific fighter, but hes unproven and fights against some of these men would have answered alot of questions. Cant wait to hear your opinions.......please SHARE THEM!
I think he would have done well. the hardest opponents of the group would have been Moore and Johnson. Roland beat Rex Layne who beat Walcott, Brion,Satterfield. He also beat Keene Simmons (who was pretty durable) hanging in with the likes of Satterfield and Cleveland Williams (only getting stopped by Marciano in 8)while in his prime. Roland also dropped Ted Lowry on his way to a win. Baker and Valdes were handled by Moore. Henry was a good fighter but Moore and Johnson beat him. I think Roland had good skills as well as decent power but he was punished and ruined by Marciano in the 2nd fight. I think he would have handled himself well even with Moore and Johnson. Valdez posed a threat but was eratic and 4 strait loses in 1953 and a dominant loss to Satterfield in 1955 proves he was sporatic. I think he had a good chance to beat all but I would favor Moore in a decision. Oh I forgot Walcott, J.J. beats him and Charles was the better man and Louis was still a hard man to beat. I had to take a second look at the list I missed afew of the names...Walcott,Charles,Louis,Moore were better men...
1. Moore--Moore too savvy for LaStarza & stronger puncher--Moore by decision 2. Walcott--Walcott too good. 3. Charles--Charles too good 4. Louis--Joe was still good enough to beat LaStarza 5. Satterfield--I think LaStarza was durable enough to last against Satterfield. I pick him to edge out a decision. 6. Walls--LaStarza avoids Walls early and comes on for decision. 7. Harold Johnson--I like Johnson, but I think LaStarza might be able to score an upset here. It would be a very tactical fight. 8. Valdes--Valdes was so erratic and he was certainly capable of being outboxed and his stamina undercut him late a few times. On the other hand, has huge physical advantages over LaStarza and should be able to stand up to the best Roland can throw. I think close to a toss-up, but I'll give the edge to Nino. 9. Baker--Managed to be outboxed by Harris when past best. LaStarza will move much more than most he fought and if Baker has to keep moving, how good will his stamina prove to be? I would like to see more film of him, as well as Valdes, to refresh my memory. I judge this a toss-up. 10. Jackson--had trouble with speed and there were questions raised about his real class. He lost 2 of 3 to Slade. I think LaStarza can handle him. 11. Henry--I do not remember ever seeing him on TV or on film. LaStarza has a shot, as Henry was outboxed by Frank Buford once. Losses to Johnson and Moore might indicate quickness and skill gave him the most trouble--no surprise. LaStarza has a chance to edge out a close one, but I have to take Henry. A kind of a shot in the dark though.
I think Moore and Charles beat him pretty clearly, both being more experienced and probably better pure athletes than he was, as well as heavier hitters (definitely in Moore's case, probably in Charles'). Walcott is a somewhat different story for me, in that, although he was better than LaStarza in the same aforementioned ways, he also had a somewhat quirky style that was often stunningly effective, but could be almost neutralized by an opponent with the right style if Walcott wasn't having one of his real top performances. Maxim, for example, was a cautious, guarded boxer who didn't give you a lot to work with offensively and didn't leave a lot of room for counters or potshotting, and he was able to put Walcott into a sort of slow-dance mode and take him to three close, boring decisions. I think LaStarza has a respectable chance at nicking a decision off Walcott, and it wouldn't be a total shock if he caught one in a series with Charles or Moore, but I'd bet against it. I think LaStarza vs. a 1950-51 Louis is pretty close to a 50/50 match. Louis had a limited offense at that stage of his career and failed to put away lesser boxer-type Omelio Agramonte in two outings, and LaStarza is hardly likely to put Joe away, so I'm seeing this going the distance. Louis would still have some natural advantages and would be the heavier hitter, but LaStarza would be quicker and busier. He did do significantly better both times against Marciano than Louis did. Maybe LaStarza SD. I think the chances are pretty good LaStarza stops Satterfield. He did deck Bucceroni five times in their rematch and knock out the durable Vern Mitchell. Satterfield tended to be wild in the early rounds, but I think a cautious, durable and defensively adept guy like LaStarza would ride the storm fairly comfortably. LaStarza takes over in the middle rounds and stops Satterfield late or takes a UD, I think. I'll do the rest of the ones I feel comfortable analyzing and make up a total or something later, when my mind is fresher.
Lastarza was a protected fighter,his manager steered him clear of the real threats to cash in on a return with Marciano,losses to Bucceroni and Jones give the truth about Roland on a given night any of those mentioned might beat him,but the same can be said of a lot of 50,s guys Baker ,Henry,Wallace, Walls ,Satterfield ,Gomez,and Valdes were all capable of beating each other if they were on top form Lastarza's resume is pretty thin imo.
thanx for the great responses! I will give my predictions soon The thing is I have louis vs agramonte II and Agramonte had more mobility, footspeed, and head movement than lastarza making him a difficult target to hit cleanly for an older fighter(note I think lastarza overall was defintley the superior fighter to agramonte).... Also Louis did catch agramonte, floored him with two very hard right hands in succesion for 9 count, agramonte was nearly out. Even if Louis cant put away lastarza, is it unreasonable to assume he still wont win a decision? Louis won wide decisions over ranked contenders utilizing his heavy elegant jab, and he has huge size advantage over roland, and had very technical boxing skills at the advanced age.
I think Lastarza would have beating Louis by 1951 or so, I think if Charles speed, and defense and movement was able to carry the day, I give Roland a great shot in repeating the process. The Aramonte fight, well, After that knockdown, Aramonte ran for the rest of the fight. I cant blame Joe for not catching up to him, He was no longer prime.
I have not seen either Agramonte fight, but I am under the impression that these were one-sided decisions. Is that how you judge the one you have seen? I would expect LaStarza to last but to lose a fairly decisive decision to Louis in 1951.
I pretty much agree with this. LaStarza was a good boxer. He had little power, but he could make it a tough night for sluggers. Indeed, some feel he deserved the nod over Marciano in the first fight. Lastarza beat the up and down Lanye, and Bucceroni. However, LaStarza's list of opponents is full of cream cheese. I agree he did not fight enough contenders. Here are my picks: Clarence Henry UD over Lastarza Nino Valdez UD over LaSstarza Lastarza UD over Bob Baker Ezzard Charles- 1950-1951 - UD over LaStarza Jersey Joe Walcott- 1950-51 - UD over LaStarza LaStarza SD over Joe Louis- 1950-51 Archie Moore - Moore via TKO Harold Johnson - Hmmm....Johnson via SD Bob Satterfield - Satterfield via Ko ( Lastarza lacked the power ) Hurricane Jackson - LaStarza via UD Earl Walls - Don't know much about Walls.
why would you pick valdez over lastarza but not louis over lastarza? Louis even in 1950 was argueably better than any version on nino valdez.... Im also suprised by the lastarza over baker pick considering baker outboxed valdez twice and usually dominated smaller boxer types. perhaps contrast of styles? Valdez had an excellent jab, but so did louis thanx for the picks though
Agramonte looks pretty good on film. A real slick speester. Only thing that kept him from being a very good fighter was his small size and lack of power
Baker looked pretty good to me against Satterfield ,Id certainly rather watch those two fight than Wlad against another reluctant Russian like Ibragimov.
Here are my picks Valdez MD over Lastarza- Valdez superior size and jab a big difference in the fight. Lastarzas counterpunching against wild valdez wins him many rounds. Lastarza down once. Baker UD over lastarza- Baker was a bigger version of lastarza, pretty much. Almost identical styles. Louis UD lastarza- Close fight, Louis outjabs him the whole time, and pushes lastarza around in the clinches with his superior size. Louis heavy punches mark up lastarzas face something horribly. Lastarza wins rounds with his youth and reflexes, but gets staggered a bunch of times by louis left hooks and right hands. Roland Lastarza UD Bob Satterfield- DR. Z claimed lastarza lacked power, but he forgets satterfield had a glass jaw. I like lastarza to outbox satterfield and keep his wild exhanges at bay with his smooth combinations. Clarence Henry UD lastarza- Great fight, very close.....I like Henrys more electrifying offensive firepower as the difference, and his superior handspeed. Lastarzas counterpunching would give an offensive orriented fighter like henry trouble, but I expect henry to pull it out. Moore TKO lastarza- The cagey Mongoose snipes his victim somewhere during the fight. Charles UD lastarza- wide decision Walcott UD lastarza- I perfectly agree with MF's assesment of this fight, but if walcott gets aggresive he can take roland out. Roland Lastarza SD Earl Walls- Lastarza down twice early by vicious right hands, gets up and survives the onslaught the next 2 rounds. behind on points lastarza climbs back into the fight late by outsmarting outboxing walls, with walls landing effective points with his jab. Lastarza controls the tempo of the fight. The decision is in, lastarza wins a 1 point split decision in a near dead even fight
I also have a baker fight in which he wins........he looks even better in that one. Bob Baker is an underachiever......an excellent amatuer who had extrordinary boxing skills and defense for a man his size 6'2 220lb. He could punch too.Coupled with his size, It made him very hard to beat for smaller fighters. Baker suffered horrible hand injuries that caused him to take a nose dive post 1955 in his career, his prime was a short one. But in his prime, the man could fight. I hope John Garfield chimes in on Baker. Baker should have fought patterson for the title........baker was robbed in the eliminater vs hurricane jackson. When patterson asked to fight Baker in 1955, Damato told him "when your ready to fight top heavyweights ill let you know, but not against a guy like baker."(Floyd pattersons book) A baker vs Marciano fight would have been a good one, marciano would have eventually broke him down by round 10