Roughly Were Would You Put Floyd Mayweather Jr In A/Your ATG List, at this stage?

By saying he isn't among the best I've ever seen? Sorry, that's an opinion built up from watching a lot of fights and a lot of fighters. Floyd is not among the best of them. If you or anyone else would like I'll name some names as to who I'm more impressed by on film.

 

Nope. Just in general you underrate him.

 

I disagree. I don't like him at all, which is why I so commonly speak of him in a lowly manner. Only when a comparison between he and the true greats of the sports comes up do I question his accomplishments and ability, because, IMO they're simply not up to par. Then again, to be completely honest, his accomplishments likely never will because of the weakness of the era he's fighting in. I consider him head and shoulders above anyone around today, and believe he'd beat them all unquestionably. Unfortunately, given the lack of true class for him to fight, we'll never really know how well he stacks up to the true greats of the sport, even if he does defeat them all. I consider Pacquiao a better P4P fighter than Floyd, but I believe Floyd would beat him no questions asked in a matchup due to his size advantage.

With this kind of viewpoint, I can only really judge him based on what he shows in the ring, and with performances like the one Saturday, against completely overmatched opponents, he isn't doing himself any favors other than to the delusional fans who believe Marquez stood any sort of chance in the first place. IMO, he hasn't proven to be a truly special fighter since his 130 pound days.

 

Yeah, I did, after saying how stupid I was for forgetting him because I was tired/stonedatsch

 

And? Monzon smoked (cigarettes) during roadwork. Chad Dawson was busted for Marijuana after winning a fight.

Doesn't help me haul my ass down to the gym very often but allows me to get very deeply immersed in fights and notice little nuances I wouldn't usually spot:good

 

Yeah, a Pro Gym in Southampton. Looks can be deceiving and that photo was taken when I was.....17??? Something like that. You obviously don't think I look very tough, but I'm probably tougher than the guy who sends PM's being rude about someones appearance and trying to intimidate them? Or 'keyboard warriors' as they're known.

Is your record on Boxrec?

 

He's a more skilled boxer technically than Tiger, but arguably not as effective. You could argue otherwise, but the facts are that Tiger is far more proven against top notch opposition than Floyd is. Depends on what you prefer. I consider Tiger the greater fighter, though.

Ortiz is a difficult case. Based on the informed opinion of those who've watched him fight in person, he was one of the best fighters of the era and one of the first turnovers into the modern style of boxing. According to them, there's been no Bantamweight to match him, Jofe coming closest. That is mighty high praise from first hand accounts of the man. Unfortunately, not only is there little footage of him, but he was one of the types that didn't take the sport as seriously as he could have. Because of this, he'd often come into bouts looking out of shape and/or lackadaisical. One of those fighters that could look sublime one night, then lackluster the other. In terms of talent though, I'd rate him among the best to have ever fought at the lower weights.

In the footage available on Youtube against Castillo, he shows fantastic in-fighting ability. My2Sense compared him to Barney Ross. I'd agree in his general look and stance, but he seemed to be much more of an inside oriented, unorthodox type than Ross. No doubt he'd be a handful for any Bantamweight to have ever laced up the gloves.

As to how he matches up in a P4P sense to Floyd, I'd say that based on ability he'd be right up there no question. Floyd, while fighting under far different conditions than Ortiz (which are also things that need to be taken into account with these kinds of comparisons), has been a much more consistent performer. I don't consider him any more talented or capable a boxer, though.

 

One of my favorite past-times.

 

:good:goodGot some Afghani Resin on the blow at the moment Pea, watching some Luis Rodriguez:smoke

 

I'd have to do more research on Ortiz to come up with my own informed opinion on the matter. Based on the opinions of those who are a lot more knowledgable on the man, I wouldn't have any problem with someone rating Ortiz above Floyd.

On paper Floyd's record looks great. If you dig just a bit deeper, you'll see what an easy career he's had. He's still relatively untested, and the only guys to have really pushed him were a poor man's Julio Cesar Chavez and an old, shopworn De La Hoya. Since moving up from 130 I don't consider him anything special in comparison to any of the true greats, despite the fact that he's more than grown into the weight classes. It's really only his work at that weight that has me considering his all time potential.