Roy Jones Jr winning a HW title.

And Jones beat Ruiz before Toney did. So, I don't see Toney beating Ruiz in any way diminishing Jones's victory over Ruiz. I do think that Ruiz losing to two natural middleweights is more of a knock against him than either Jones or Toney. Ruiz, quite simply, was medicore.

 

Holyfield was old. Ruiz also faked lowblows against Johnson. Golota was robbed.Rahman was fare. Oquendo was a questionable stoppage.

 

I don't know. I kind of feel like he "cheated" by taking on Ruiz. Lennox Lewis was the real champion. It would have been like Michael Spinks moving up to heavyweight and taking on Trevor Berbick rather than Larry Holmes. I get the feeling that if Spinks did that, he would be mercilessly mocked to this day had he not fought Larry Holmes.

He ought to get credit for accomplishing it on paper, but it's not up there with Moses parting the Red Sea.

 

That's a solid list of names in the early 2000's heavyweight scene. I thought Golota faded big time. He had Ruiz ready to go but Ruiz busted out his tentacles. Like an octopus.

I can't stand John Ruiz. But he was one tough hombre.

 

Holmes at that point was not on Lewis' level, nor was he ever Lewis' size.

 

Ruiz was pretty awful. Hard to find anything good to say about him. Sneaky right hand.

 

The point is that he fought the best champion available.

 

I see no slowness nor lack power. 44 WINS WITH 30 BY k0.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ruiz

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Jones won with the help of the ref and Toney won by taking steroids and was divested of his title for it..

He beat Galota, Rahman, Johnson, Holyfield, and Fres Oquendo. All fighters who were considered prospects. Fres Oquendo had beaten James Toney and was robbed by the judges.

Undersized? Ruiz weighed 235 pounds and was 6'2"

Frazier weighed 205 and Ali weighed 215 when they fought. Foreman fought at 218 Marciano was 5'11" 182 pounds!

If Ruiz was undersized, then what were these guys? Midgets?

 

He lost the title in order to duck Tony Tucker.

 

That's BS. Those Johnson blows were blatantly low. In fact, they got Johnson disqualified. Ruiz floored Johnson twice and Johnson attempted to illegally tackle him by lunging at his legs.

Holyfield got floored and illegally held on and should have been disqualified. Ruiz beat Holyfield in the first fight despite the ref allowing him to use martial arts by using his elbows but was robbed by the judges.

Galotta had the ref on his side during the whole fight and was allowed to foul but still lost.

Jones deserves no credit for that supposed win. The ref won it for him.

James Toney cheated with drugs so he doesn't deserve credit either.

Ruiz was robbed in Germany when he fought Valuev.

BTW
Holyfield was only called old whenever he fought Ruiz. After the Ruiz fights he was touted as a viable contender for the HW title held by Lewis.

 

Cooney vs Spinks was the fight that the public wanted . Tony Tucker was relatively unknown to the public. Hence the fact that Spinks was paid 4 million dollars and was offered only half a million dollars for Tony Tucker.

Remember, these fighters do this for a living. They don't just fight for glory and honor, many times it's $$$. The bottom line for Spinks was his bank balance and if Spinks was paid more, he'd have fought Tucker.

So if accepting a 4 million dollar fight in lieu of a 500,000 dollar fight is "ducking", then who wouldn't have ducked?

 

Jones definitely deserves credit, but everyone knew the true champion at the time was Lennox Lewis. Ruiz was basically a paperchampion. Still I would have liked to see Jones fight Holyfield, Oquendo, Byrd, and some of the smaller heavyweights rather than draining himself back to 175lbs, which proved to be distatrious.

 

IMO beltholders are just the top contenders in a division but not champs. Therefore Jones beat a top contender at heavyweight. Nothing to sniff at and certainly an achievement but he did not win the hw championship. There's plenty of mws in boxing history who beat top hw contenders (and many who did this more than once).

 

Excuses.

Jones, who was a natural super middleweight, and had never before fought in the HW division, easily beat him with superior foot and hand speed. Ruiz couldn't wrestle and grapple with him as Jones didn't plod forward.

And Ruiz was somewhat undersized for his era.

Of course, he didn't lose to Jones and Toney because he was 'undersized." They were naturally smaller than him. He lost because they were better atheletes with better skill.

Let's examine this statement, "He beat Galota, Rahman, Johnson, Holyfield, and Fres Oquendo. All fighters who were considered prospects."

As you know, timing of matchups matters. Simply listing names of guys he beat means little without proper context. Otherwise Pat Lawlor, with wins over Wilfred Benitez and Roberto Duran, would be highly regarded. Gerry Cooney, with wins over Jimmy Young, Ron Lyle and Ken Norton would be HOF worthy.

But of course Cooney fought those guys after their primes as did Lawlor. And Ruiz fought most of these guys after their best days were gone, as well.

"Prospect" means an up and comer. All the names you listed that Ruiz beat were past peak except Johnson. He is the only one who coud be considered a "prospect" when Ruiz fought him.

Holyfield:

38 yrs old when Ruiz edged him. Had defeated Ruiz in the first fight. Was able to hold Ruiz to a draw in the third fight.

Don King apparently wanted to push Ruiz, as he got the second fight even though the first fight was not that controversial.

Andrew Golota

36 yrs old. Was coming off a suprisingly good performance over Chris Byrd. Of course, Byrd was past his best and was a natural Super Middleweight. Even in that performance, Golota looked far from his 1996-1997 prime form. Even so, Golota almost beat Ruiz.

Hasim Rahman

Hadn't won in his last three fights before facing Ruiz. Coming off a draw with David Tua, a technical decison loss to the aforementioned declining Holyfield and a Ko loss to Lennox Lewis.

Fres Oquendo

Had lost two of his last four fights before facing Ruiz. Had been stopped by David Tua and decisoned by Chris Byrd.

Kirk Johnson

Okay he was undefeated. But, the outcome of this win was hardly convincing.


Well, we have 'tards for a number of fighters, so why not Ruiz?