Roy Jones v. 1919 Jess Willard

Yes, if you were to read half the argument proposed you might be correct. Size comes into play in conjunction with quality.

Willard in 1919 was a complete galoot. His size and alleged strength would not save him against someone with Jones lightning speed and ability to find his target.

 

Don't you get it?

Once you employ this line of argument, the size advantage of modern superheavyweights over old timers, can be dismissed just as easily.

Big fighters are by and large slower and less skilled than their smaller counterparts.

 

But the big modern fighters we discuss tend to be among the faster big men, and also among the more skilled ones.

If we were discussing Julius Long and how he would dominate Louis'/Dempseys era on the merit of just his size and then saying Roy beats the utter crap out of Willard, that would be hypocricy.

But the big top heavyweights like Wlad and Lewis have more than just size and know how to use it to their full advantage.

It's the context that matters, when Wlad or Lewis are discussed. Those men have the skills and they're just as skilled as most of the smaller top heavyweight back then. In that case the size differential is decisive.

But for a guy like Julius Long who doesn't have the skills, he has his size to depend on but nothing much. He can be easily done by a good small fighter because Long is just size and nothing else.
His size helps, but he's not good enough that his size will decide things against top contenders of yesteryear.

 

The old fighters didn't have the modern skill and technique that the mods did. The mods weren't fighting back then. So many think a 1919 Roy Jones would be the same Roy Jones. As Andy Griffith might say: "get some smart!"
Eras can't be compared plain and simple.

 

I am not even convinced that Lewis and wlad were standouts among superheavyweights in terms of technique to be honest.

What made them standouts might have been something as subtle as reflexes and coordination.

Perhaps they were merely the product of the facility to fill a faster Fred Fulton type figther out to 240lbs.

Either way, once you are prepared to alow exceptions to the size matters rule, it kind of undermines it across the board.

 

The Willard of the JJohnson fight would have knocked JJones out. Willard was too big and still athletic.

 

The 1915 Willard, especially under the 45 round limit, is very much a favorite. The old, inactive Willard of 1919 looks like he is on roller skates even before Dempsey tags him.

 

do the modern fighters have the old skills and techniques?

 

No, of course not... since all the great trainers are now gone, there's no one to pass on the great skills and techniques of yesteryear to today's fighters. Body punching, feinting, ring generalship, etc.... all mysteriously gone. Forever!

 

He was unprepared to fight 1919 Dempsey but that doesn't mean he'd lose to anyone.
It was obviously the oldest, rustiness Willard to that date, but he was 15 pounds lighter than he'd been in 1916 against Frank Moran. So I'm guessing he'd done some preparation.
Also, in 1923 Willard was another 4 years older and rustier still and managed to beat a fighter Floyd Johnson who wasn't the worst fighter to have ever laced up the gloves.

 

wach can't beat dempsey, wlad can. how dare i make picks based on actual quality rather than just size and era? what a ridiculous **** i must be to think sometimes the really good big modern guy wins and sometimes the not so good big modern guy loses.

in this case we have a 12 round fight between a hugely able and skilled guy who did beat a big man and a big man who was averagely skilled, out of shape and was beaten by a smaller man. pretty easy pick regardless of era.

edit - dempsey willard was 12 rds, so i assumed this is too.

 

dont write wladdies name in with demps. wlsddie gets tappesd out by fat nobodies again and again..and again...and again. and runs a milion miles from rematching for a repeat ko.
dempsey. one mistake, and he rematched and killed the guy.

 

Funny you speak of running from opponents...

At least Waldo never drew the colour line.

 

RJJ certainly could win a UD over Willard. But he's not stopping him and as horrible as some of his technique is, Willard could hit hard. I wouldn't be surprised to see RJJ clown him for half the fight and then get a hole punched through him. Jones would have to be on his bike, creating angles, sticking and moving all night.

 

Jones by stoppage.

Probably like Pac v Hoya, it would get difficult to watch.