Roy Jones vs Haye at CW

You could bet your life, that Haye wouldn't have bombed him out in a few rounds.

The respect that he had for Roy's speed, as well as his overall ability would have made him ultra cautious early on, IMHO.

There's no way he'd have walked over just looking for the knockout.

You've hit the nail on the head.

I think most of these guys just envisage the knockout losses to Tarver and Johnson, and forget just how great Roy was before he fought Ruiz.

Haye has shown reluctance in a few fights, and he would have been facing a guy who was even faster than he was.

 

Roy didn't really lose any speed moving up to HW.. I thought he was clearly faster than Ali and Patterson..

Also, Roy was smaller than Ali and Patterson....

 

Go away and do some research you fool.

Go and read excerpts from Jim Thomas's book (Evander's former attorney) then get back to us.

Roy wanted huge money to remain at HW.

Do you know why?

BECAUSE HE WAS A 35 YEAR OLD LHW, WHO'D FOUGHT 50 TIMES.

If he fought Ruiz for a guaranteed $15m, then why would he have agreed to have fought a hard hitting southpaw in Sanders for LESS money?

He swerved Sanders to try and fight Holyfield in a BiGGER fight.

You really are thick aren't you?

What to do you think he'd have got paid to fight Vitali and Tua?

Like any other 35 year old LHW would have considered fighting those guys, unless it was for a huge amount of money.

This has been explained to you countless times.

A fight with Tyson was on the horizon for 2004, until both guys got knocked out.

A fight with Evander was a whisker away from being made, until King got greedy with the PPV split, and Evander was that pissed, he ended up fighting Toney for LESS money.


Now run along.

 

Patterson was smaller than Roy and fought bigger threats than Roy did. My point was lets see Roy against another well skilled Heavyweight with speed and then make the assessment. He fought Ruiz who was slow as molasses. Even Vitali Klitschko would look fast against Ruiz :roflatsch

Again, not saying Roy was slow but I think there are certainly several guys who were faster than him at Heavyweight who were also bigger than him.

You can't use a sample size of John Ruiz and claim Roy was the fastest ever. Heck just about anyone was faster than Ruiz.

I would like to see Roy against an Ali, Patterson, Tyson, even a Greg Page or even Corrie Sanders who Jones had the chance to fight but refused and then we could judge how fast he was. :good

 

No, not just based on the Ruiz win, based on every other fight he'd had.

It doesn't matter that he only fought at HW once.

He was the fastest MW, SMW and LHW on the planet when he fought there.

HW was no different.

He didn't lose any speed hand speed when he went up.

 

I am looking beyond the Ruiz fight, Roy's hand speed looked blazing against anyone he fought, and he didn't seem to lose much of it at HW. I have not seen a HW that I think was faster than Roy at HW.

Ring Magazine agrees with me as well, I would have to did up one of my old magazines, but it read something like, "Ali and Patterson were fast HWS, Roy Jones was faster than them both"

If you are not going to argue Roy was the fastest LHW ever, It shouldn't be too much of a reach for you to admit he was likely the fastest HW ever. Being as he pretty much had the same speed at both weights.

 

It is impossible to tell how fast he was when he fought a guy as slow of hand and foot as Ruiz was hence why the fight was made in the first place he was ZERO threat. I don't care what Jones did at Light Heavyweight against the line of guys he fought. That was an awful era for the Division and he didn't even fight the #1 fighter in that Division.

I have NEVER said Jones was not fast I would be delusional to say such. You can't base his speed on one fight and especially against John Ruiz.

Say Ruiz fought Wlad or Vitali and I came on here and posted:

What would be your response to that statement? :think

 

How could a fighter with such a disgraceful glass mandible that used to be 154lbs, fight at HW with ZERO threat?:huh

That ERA wasn't the toughest, but it is underrated.. It was tougher than both MW and SMW at the time. Which is why Hopkins admittedly waited to come up and priced himself out of a fight with Roy...

And yes, technically Roy did fight and beat the #1 fighter in that division after he came down from HW.

Yes, calling Jones slow would be as delusional as calling Tyson feather fisted. And I am not basing Roy's speed on one fight.. He was clearly the fastest at any weight he fought at, his speed was proven to be top notch, not just in his era, but any era, it just doesn't get much faster... I am supposed to believe his speed was an illusion because he was fighting Ruiz?atsch

Are we really going to compare Wlad and Vitali to Jones?

Two totally different levels of speed, one is in one universe and one is in another.

 

I am talking about his speed at Heavyweight. I don't care how fast he was at SMW (another division where he doesn't have a sample size of opponents to judge how good he was because he didn't hang around to make big fights) or at LHW. At Heavyweight we don't have a good sample size simply saying he was the fastest at LHW doesn't cut it. All I am saying is it would be nice to see him against another HW that was also fast to compare. Am I unrealistic or out of line to say he might not look as fast against someone else with speed and skill like even a Chris Byrd? You have to put John Ruiz in perspective. He was flat footed, slow, had no power and no skill. That is going to make Roy able to try and do things ie: take more chances he wouldn't be able to do against someone with speed and skills you can leave power out of the equation. We didn't ever see Roy in the ring with a savage puncher either even though there were several willing and able opponents throughout the 5 weight classes he fought in.

 

Stopped reading here, Jones-Toney was by far the biggest non HW fight at the time, and the best fight in the division.. How can we not use that fight to judge Roy's skills?

If I remember correctly, Jones moving up and handling Toney's power was a huge question mark..

 

:roflatsch

He fought Ruiz for 10mil guaranteed plus PPV upside. That is the SAME deal he had for the Sanders fight. Same venue. Same ring. Same gloves. Same network. Get your Facts straight. No reason to even discuss this with you when you can't even get anything right.

 

It was again one fight. One. That is not a large sample size. Answer the question am I out of line for asking to see how Jones looked against a Heavyweight with speed and skills like Byrd. We can leave power out of it. Is that unrealistic of me before we crown Roy as the fastest ever at Heavyweight? Skills being the big part of it as we both know Ruiz had zero of that.

 

Why would he have had to have knocked out Ruiz to have proven how fast he was? atsch

 

He got $15m plus for Ruiz and he wasn't guaranteed to make that for a Sanders fight.

Therefore he WANTED MORE money to fight Sanders because he was a bigger threat, dumbass!

To remain at HW at almost 35, he wanted huge money.

He turned down the offer, and wanted more.

He wasn't going to accept either less, or the same amount, which could potentially have earnt him as much as what he'd made against Ruiz.

Do you understand??

You're talking about a 35 year old LHW, fighting a hard hitting, 6'4 southpaw who'd just knocked out Wlad.

You can't have it both ways Rico.

If Roy was a glass jawed LHW, then you can't have any complaints if he wanted huge money to fight a hard hitting southpaw at HW.

 

Haye is a big boy. Haye by KO