Roy Jones was better than Sugar Ray Robinson

Robinson didn't come close to fighting everyone, where are the fights with Charley Burley, Cocoa Kid, Holman Williams, George Benton, Dave Sands, Henry Hank, Charles Humez, etc, etc, etc

 

But I sorta kinda disagree about his chin , reason being Jones when in his prime I can't remember him ever being nailed cleanly. His reflexes were so great even against world class competition he was barely touched. Even when it seemed he got hit hard, he would ride the shot . No his chin was average at best.

 

While SRR undoubtely was the greater fighter, I do think you can make an argument that Jones was the better fighter. It's extremely difficult, impossible really, to exactly compare quality of opposition, but I've never seen anyone look as superior to his as Jones did.

 

You're right that Jones was utterly dominant in fights during his prime. I would argue that he was at his absolute peak between 1995 and 1996. He was an incredible talent at that point... but after Toney he spent the next two full years avoiding challenges. His 7 fights during that period:
Antoine Byrd
Vinny Pazienza
Tony Thornton
Merqui Sosa
Eric Lucas
Bryant Brannon
Mike McCallum

This is him at his peak and he was talking about how much better he was than everybody else, playing basketball matches on the day of his fights like there was no real challenge out there and he needed to be stretched and he had Gerald McClellan 8 pounds south and ready to go plus Nigel Benn, who was already known stateside, and Eubank if he had so wanted. Now, I'm not saying he wouldn't have beaten all of them. I think he would. But surely they were worth his time?

It's my one criticism of him - when the challenges were there, he didn't want to know. You can't say there's no-one to fight while avoiding fellow titlists who would likely provide a genuine challenge.. and then fight Vinny Pazienza, Eric Lucas and a 41 year old McCallum.

That was my impression of Jones at his peak, rightly or wrongly.

 

Agree. Benn, McClellan, Collins... There were a number of very taste fights out there that didn't happen. Had he looked as impressive against those guys as he did otherwise...

 

How much better were these^ fighters than those Sugar Ray Robinson actually beat?

Robinson fought tens of ranked fighters; many top-5 opponents and beat multiple divisional greats from the Lightweight, Welterweight and Middleweight classes, as well as beating recognized All-Time Pound-for-Pound Greats.

For example:

- Sammy Angott
- Randy Turpin
- Georgie Abrams
- Bobo Olson
- Gene Fullmer
- Henry Armstrong
- Kid Gavilan
- Carmen Basilio
- Jake LaMotta
- Fritzie Zivic


How much better was Charley Burley than Frtizie Zivic or Georgie Abrams?
How much better was Cocoa Kid than Henry Armstrong (or Izzy Jannazzo)?
How much better was Holman Williams than Jake Lamotta (or Jose Basora)?
How much better was Charles Humez than Randolph Turpin or Gene Fullmer?


It appears as though you don't fully understand the scope of the subject you're throwing names at.
In any event, it would be clear to anyone that Robinson tested himself against the best.
We can't say that about Roy Jones Jr.

 

Bernard Hopkins Reggie Johnson etc were easily on par with the best guys Roy failed to fight so that argument doesn't hold water

 

Part of being a great fighter is cleaning out your era and beating the best opponents available. Robinson had many fights against guys that didn't appear to pose a threat and could have worked in Burley Williams Marshall Sands etc. I would say Booker Marshall Burley and Moore were all better middle weights than LaMotta

 

So just ignore the fact that Ray had 3 times as many fights. . That may factor in. Every fight is mileage. You also bring up Maxim though Sugar Ray dominated him and it was a fluke. You gave Roy a pass for Griffen though.

 

"Part of being a great fighter is clean out your division"

Nice. You had us thinking you were serious.

I will say that at Middleweight Roy could beat Ray. He was naturally bigger. As long as he take Robinson's punch. Roy certainly wouldnt seek out a fight with Robinson..

 

Sugar Ray went to Europe to defend his title against a top contender in Randy Turpin.

Roy didn't want to go there to face Darius. Just a different mindset. Maybe if Robinson was making millions a fight he would have done the same.

 

Put their resumes side by side and you could tow a double wide through it

 

Unfortunately, this and other quite obvious facts are being ignored.

It would seem there’s an unwillingness to engage in reasoned debate.

 

He is kidding on the square.

 

That’s a polite way of putting it...

...I particularly like the “

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” line.

Naturally, my mind immediately turned to all those threatening opponents that Roy was cleaning out of Boxing - like Lightweight-turned-Super Middle Pazienza. Or, penultimate fight pensioner, McCallum.