Saad v Corbett 15rds?

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by mcvey, Oct 1, 2020.


  1. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    The 1st Sharkey fight was a draw..Choynski was then a middleweight.Mitchell was 165lbs,Kilrain was a 6 rounder.Sullivan was a washed up alcoholic who hadnt fought for nearly 5 years
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
  2. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    The 1st Sharkey fight was a draw..Choynski was then a 20 years old middleweight.Mitchell was 165lbs,Kilrain was a 6 rounder.Sullivan was a washed up alcoholic who hadn't fought for nearly 5 years.
    Box Rec has Corbett's record as 11-4-3. Very unimpressive imo.
    Can you provide me with a link to view these 24 fights of Corbett's?
    neither Box Rec of CBZ lists that many.
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
  3. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    What are Corbett's, "good wins above175lbs?" A nearly 5 years retired alcoholic Sullivan which took him21 rds to accomplish who else? A 6 rounder with Kilrain? In 5 years Corbett successfully defended his title just once against 165pound Mitchell.Then he lost it to 167lbs Fitz!
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
  4. Bukkake

    Bukkake Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Today there are several huge (6'6" 240 lbs, or thereabouts) undefeated heavyweights with only about a dozen or so fights, with not a single win over a ranked opponent - like Joyce, Dubois, Hergovic, Dychko, Ajagba. Are you saying, that because none of them can claim a good heavyweight win, Corbett should be favored to beat them?
     
  5. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    11-4-3 Fights were not easy to make?
    In a career spanning 14years Corbett had 18fights!
    From1882 to 1892 = 10 years Fitzsimmons had 73!
    From 1884 to1894=10years Choynski had 70 fights!
    From1888 to1898 =10years Peter Maher had over 100 fights!
    From1891 to 1901=10years Kid McCoy had over 90 fights!
    So was it just Corbett that had this difficulty in getting fights do you think?LOL
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
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  6. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    The big fights back then due to legal reasons and police interference were not easy to make. If you want to count Corbett's shorter fights, I can list 25+ plus that Box Rec doesn't have. Like I said, I have Corbett at 59-0-3 prior to facing Fitzsimmons, partly with the aid of news decisions, but complete with names, dates and venues.

    If you want a better source, Wiki sys he had 35 fights. Corbett a champion did offer a re-match to Jackson, who didn't take it.

    But let's use your 11-4-3 record. For so few fights he beat 5 men in the hall of fame, drew with another and lost to two. That's a very good record. Who did Saad ever beat at heavyweight? Do tell. Saad lost 16 times was was Ko'd 8 times.
     
  7. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    No you cant list any of Corbett' s exhibition bouts as real fights try looking onCBZ!
    By the way 2 of Corbetts listed fights against McCaffrey ,and Lannon may well have been exhibitions.That would bring his total down to 16 and then be 9-4-3! Wiki isnt a credible source!
    And they credit Corbett with 20 fights so your statement is bull**** anyway!

    James J. Corbett - Wikipedia
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_J._Corbett

    James John "Jim" Corbett (September 1, 1866 – February 18, 1933) was an American professional boxer and a World Heavyweight Champion, best known as the only man who ever defeated the great John L. Sullivan (hence the "man who beat the man" concept of the championship boxing lineage.) Despite a career spanning only 20 bouts, Corbett faced the best competition his era had to offer; squaring off with a total of 9 fighters who would later be enshrined alongside him in the International Boxing Hall of Fame.



    Corbett ran out on a rematch with Jackson refusing to even consider a rematch with him anywhere but south of the Mason Dixon line,and he only entertained the possibility of such a match when Jackson was safely out of the country.
    Who did Corbett beat who was over 175lbs,a washed up Sullivan and Kilrain in a 6 rounder.
    Saad had 58 fights against the likes of
    Qawi x2
    Conteh x2
    M Johnson x2
    Lopez x2
    Johnson
    Parlov
    Kates
    Mwale
    Muhammad
    Camel
    In the deepest light heavyweight era ever.

    Six of Saad's losses came when he was turned 36 and he was only ko'd ,as in counted out , once in his last fight, when he was 38.
    Now explain how
    Fitz, a Corbett contemporary had73 fights in10 years .
    McCoy ditto had over 90 in10years.
    Choynski ditto had 70 in10 years.
    Maher ditto, had over 100 in10 years.
    Yet Corbett had 18 in14 years, and 2 of them may well have been exhibitions!
    How come nobody else had trouble amassing big numbers of fights,just Corbett? Which heavyweights did Corbett beat, a washed up nearly 5 years inactive Sullivan and a 6 rounder with Kilrain! Whoope de ****ing doo!lol While you're looking for these heavyweights that Corbett never met, have a look how many men who even scaled the light heavyweight limit that he beat!
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2020
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  8. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    It was more a criticism of people picking light heavies, who never did much above 175 over him, but I will play your game.

    Now I suspect that Joyce, Dubois, and Hergovic are men who will go on to gain significant heavyweight wins, but they they turned out to be Audley Harrison style busts, then of course we should pick Corbett over them.
     
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  9. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    He held Peter Jackson to a draw, and took Jeffries to the brink of disaster.

    Make no mistake, the man was a dangerous opponent!
     
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  10. Mendoza

    Mendoza Hrgovic = Next Heavyweight champion of the world. banned Full Member

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    I asked McVey who did Saad beat at heavyweight and he spams the board without answering the question. He's reply was typical and flawed saying Choysnki was too small. I guess he was big enough to KO Jack Johnson cold in three rounds. Whatever.

    The man's got hate issues and uses double standards all the time, hence he's not worth long replies, unless corrections are needed.

    He's also wrong, Jackson had two cites to choose from to fight Corbett for the title. Jackson declined. ( New Orleans and Jacksonville ).
     
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  11. Marcus_Italicus

    Marcus_Italicus New Member Full Member

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    Good day.
    I'll be brief because I have little time, so I'll just answer the question about Corbett's career.
    The article I was referring to is that:
    http://www.cyberboxingzone.com/boxing/corbett.htm

    You right, Corbett-Sharkey I was draw. I remembered badly, sorry.

    However, if I counted correctly, Corbett has 34 confirmed fights.

    There are also, in addition:
    fights with many unnamed minor opponents and professional boxers, in an unspecified number;
    two street fight, old style;
    two fights, reported but not confirmed;

    The data on Corbett's career therefore seem incomplete, like those of other boxers of the pioneer era.
    However, if that data are true, Corbett's career appears more respectable.
    Many of his opponents are Hall of fame or at least boxers of good quality.

    I could very well be wrong about Corbett's career: that is what I know. I am not Adam Pollack!
    Have a nice day
     
  12. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    I agree that it would be dangerous to assume that the data on Corbett's career was complete.
     
  13. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Which men over175lbs did he beat, apart from those two I mentioned?
    That was my question and you haven't answered it.Want to try again?
     
  14. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    If you think he had these extra fights the onus is on you to prove it isn't it.
    Street fights are not professional bouts.Two of those counted on his resume ,against McCaffrey and Fallon were likely exhibitions. How come we have tons of fights for Corbett's contemporaries yet he a worlds champion with several books written about him does not.
    Adam Pollack? If he , with all the research he does, couldn't find any more fights for Corbett ,I very much doubt anyone else will!
    The link you provided credits Corbett with 20 professional fights.
    Two of which, as I've said may well have been exhibitions.
    Feb 16 Joe Lannon New York, NY ND 3
    -Reports vary - "W 3" - "EX 3" - "L 3";

    4 Dominick McCaffrey Brooklyn, NY W 4
    -Reports vary - "EX 4" - "TK 4"; Technically, this was
    more of an exhibition bout; Short rounds and long rests
    were allowed; When McCaffrey retired in round 4, Corbett
    was declared the winner



    You are counting street fights and amateur fights,why I have no idea!
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2020
  15. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    I replied who, apart from a nearly 5 years retired alcoholic Sullivan and bareknuckler Kilrain in a 6 rounder who did Corbett beat who was a heavyweight ie over 175lbs? Saad didnt beat any heavyweights that Im aware of and Corbett beat just 2. Corbett refused to fight Jackson anywhere but the South it's well documented.