Saoul Mamby vs Howard Davis Jr.

Thanks for the compliments.

My paternal grandfather was a Golden Gloves boxer in the 1920's (well before my father was born, and my grandfather died about ten years before I came along, so I only know of him). While in his mid 30's my father was acquainted with a WW II Navy boxing champion who became a prominent newspaperman, and they became best friends, a relationship which ended with this former boxer's death in 2002. (Even when he was in his mid 50's, he could still pack a wallop. My father rigged up a stuffed burlap bag in the garage, and when this friend paid us a visit, he demonstrated his jab on that bag. A lighweight in his competitive days, he told us to multiply the power of his jab times four, and we'd know how hard his jab was during his Navy service. Several times, he did a simple falling step towards the bag, then this self-described cutie would explode out with a blurred corkscrew jab that rattled the entire garage we were in. Then we took turns trying to hold onto the bag as he shot his jabs out into it. The vibrations of the bag when he made impact pried our arms loose, no matter how hard we tried holding onto it, and we'd all go sprawling backwards to the floor, even my father, who stands six feet tall, and weighed over 220 pounds at the time. Quite an experience to remember.)

I came of age just as Ali was reviving boxing in the 1970's, and by virtue of my parents both being educators, and my father's best friend being a former amateur champion and newspaperman, I read a great deal about boxing. Another of my early interests was the history of photography, including motion picture history, and the evolution of movie making is closely intertwined with that of the Queensbury Rules era in boxing.

Like many others, I was then swept along by the confluence of Ali's second career, the cultural impact of Stallone's Rocky, and the unexpected success of the 1976 U.S. Olympic boxing squad. Being obsessive-compulsive, I followed boxing with a passionate interest, one easily fueled by the ubiquitous preponderance of free routine television coverage.

Perhaps not surprisingly I also messed around with boxing recreationally, as I suppose most everybody on this forum has. (There's just no substitute for the experience of putting on a pair of gloves and going at it, or learning to skip rope with the mouth clamped shut, so the jaw doesn't get broken if hit.)

As it turned out, I was merely a fair weather fan, one whose interest largely subsided after the first match between Larry Holmes and Mike Spinks, and then almost completely snuffed out by the abolition of the 15 round limit which separated the championship caliber boxers from the also-rans.

Despite my having lost interest in boxing over 20 years ago, I obviously retained what I'd already learned, a base of knowledge cultivated by comparisons of literary coverage of famous bouts with footage of those same events.

Today, internet services like youtube and myspace make many of these events readily accessible to a large population, but there is still a great deal that doesn't exist on-line, and some of that is what I've been sharing on this board.

My father was an elementary school principal for a few decades, and the husband of one of his teachers took up boxing when he was in his late 30's, and was very successful at it. (He was a cross country runner and also coached track at the school where he taught.) This teacher/boxer was a subscriber to Malcolm "Flash" Gordon's newsletter, and after he was finished reading them, he gave them to my father to pass along to me. That's what really exposed me to the seamy underbelly of contemporary boxing. ("Flash" had great respect for this teacher/boxer subscriber of his, and always installed him as a 3-1 favorite, after he stayed on his feet and went the distance with a world class opponent. That decision loss was that teacher/boxer's only career defeat, as he ended his competitive boxing days with a nice winning streak.)

I think I may have inadvertently fooled some people on this board into believing I'm better informed about boxing than I actually am. My true level of knowledge on the sport is most definitely limited, but I try to avoid discussing what I'm not sufficiently informed about (which is a great deal).

Sometimes, I have a tendency to conceptualize "outside the box," and express a perspective from an eccentric point of view, and maybe that's caught the attention of some folks. (I don't particularly like to draw attention to myself at this particular stage of my life, so the anonymity guaranteed by a nom de plume like Duo liberates me somewhat to espress myself more freely and outspokenly than I would choose to risk doing otherwise.

Because I've noticed the posts on ESB Classic to generally indicate intelligent, articulate, and well-informed thoughtful opinions and comments, I finally decided for the very first time to actually register and join an internet forum, and while abandoning my former stealthy lurking on-line, exchanging contributions and feedback has proved a rewarding experience. (I'm still stunned at reading earlier posts of mine here, and saying to myself, "Did I type that?" It's a little bit like being asked for an autograph when not used to it.)

 

You know what ?I rewatched Mamby-Watkins and slowplayed it alot and noticed alot of subtle things Mamby did that when watching at regular speed I truthully hadn't noticed.
Mamby put on a sneaky little body attack that at first appears just little slaps at Watkins body.Play in slow motion and you see he's targeting Watkins solarplexus -which doesn't require 1 to have to hit at full force.
He also had a cute little habit of turning Watkins where he wanted WHILE Mamby was punching.Thats slick.

 

When the result of that match was reported, Mamby's superior handspeed on the inside was identified as the key factor in Saoul's win over Termite. I have often wondered what Mamby's career record might look like, if his matches where all judged by former boxers who could recognize the intricacies of his artistry.

Your astute observations reassure me that my distant memory of Saoul's craftsmanship may not be faulty after all.

Let me ask you this:

Would you have been able to discern these detailed nuances of Mamby's performance against Watkins (and others like it), if it had been recorded using hand cranked silent movie film technology from a hundred years ago, instead of the quality of reproduction you have available to review? (What might this slow-motion scrutiny suggest to you about what Jack Johnson or Jack Dempsey were actually doing in the ring?)

 

Sanderline Williams was similar to Mamby as well.

Not top level, but very crafty and rarerly ever dominated.

 

Stellar stuff Duo. I might enquire of your literary pedigree also but that might be gilding the lily a bit too much.

The classic forum seems to have dropped off in quality a bit lately but they were saying that when I first joined so maybe there's a revival at hand. . . or maybe it's just me who's become a bit jaded.

Either way I respect your opinions and enjoy reading your welcome contributions.

Check your PM's when you get the chance.

 

I flunked English over four times in high school, and barely graduated. However, there can be a substantial difference between formal schooling and self-education, and I've found the latter to be far more informative. In real life, I've been a blue collar stiff working menial jobs. (Then again, Eric Hoffer was a longshoreman.)

 

Duodenum-Believe me your knowledge of boxing is no way limited.I enjoyed reading your posts.In my opinion you and John Garfield are the best posters at ESB.I learn something almost everytime I read one of your posts.

 

Thank for the sentiment, but John Garfield really is in a class totally by himself. He's actually experienced what so many of us can only post about. Frankly, I'm in awe of the guy, and would defer to him on any differences of opinion between us.

 

Davis would give a good account of himself, Saoul's experience, toughness, and ability combined would be more than enough to deal with Howard.After a rough start early, Mamby would come on later to score an unanimous decision win.

 

Mamby had a quality jab.

Watch his K.O over Kim, who one of the hardest punchers of all time couldn't stop. IMO Mamby got the better of Viruet (also on YouTube) and IMO Haley and Costello were not bad 10 stone fighters at all.

Regardless, this is about Davis. Mamby would beat Davis by decision, handily.

 

There is a possibilty that these two could have met.

June 1982

'Sweet' Saoul Mamby was the WBC Light-Welterweight Champion. At the time, the
35 year-old had a record of 32-12-5 (14 KO's). Saoul competed at Lightweight in his
early days, but was a solid 140 lb. Light-Welterweight since 1976.

Included, were '5' successful defenses since winning the Championship on February 23, 1980.

The 5' 8" veteran, was a very good boxer, and a defensive specialist who had a granite
chin. And his 70" reach helped keep his opponents on the outside. Though he appeared
to be beatable, he was not.

Howard Davis at the time had a record of 16-1-0 (6 KO's), with all his bouts coming at
135 lbs. Lightweight.

The 26 year-old, also at 5' 8", but had a slightly longer reach at 72". Howard, was very fast,
and could snap his punches well. But, his chin could be reached, and he had been dropped
numerous times in his career.
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This bout would be a 'tactical one', with Saoul and Howard 'mirroring' each other over the first
3-Rounds. Howard, with his faster hands would out-jab Saoul in Rounds 4 thru 7, to jump out
to a lead at 4-1-2 in Rounds.

Rounds 8 and 9 will be 'evenly' fought, with more defensive moves then offensive attacks.

But in Round 10, the experience would come into play, and Saoul's steady attack would
give him the edge in Rounds 10, 11 and 12.

Entering Round 13, the bout will be all 'Even' on the scorecards at {4-4-4} in Rounds.

Davis feeling the fight slipping away will try to press, even though he is not a hard-puncher.

This is where Saoul will set him up for the right-hand counter, as Davis comes forward, Saoul
will nail him over and over with right-hand leads, to sweep the last 3-Rounds, and win by a
7-4-4 Scorecard in rounds.

Experience will win it for 'Sweet Saoul'.