Serious thoughts on this Harry Greb shadow boxing video?

Worth keeping in mind that EVERYONE in modern athletics, ie from the early 80s is using PEDs. I have read a few books on this and cycling and it is bonkers but to be a top class athlete now you have to use some kind of performance enhancement. I would go as far as to say athletics is more corrupt than boxing although both lag a loooong way behind cycling. Hell the former Eastern block countries were pumping their athletes with drugs from the early 70s, many of the greatest champs from those countries and era are suffering horrible side effects from this. The US athletes then took over once the Soviet Union fragmented and now China are getting good at it.

 

Interesting, I am the opposite and have always preferred the lighter weights. Faster and more entertaining, plus many of those guys can punch. Just as many exciting KOs in lighter weights as HW. Also I suspect the recognized best fighter P4P in the world each year has more often been from weights other than HW.

 

I don't think boxers have moved on dramatically from those guys listed but it has changed since the days of Greb of course. However the mistake many people make is to assume just because the style is different it was not effective or would not still be effective against a modern technique.

 

Absolutely. There's been no advancement in skills for decades and some have argued the other way very diligently.

 

The last quantum leap in skill advancement came when Tommy “Hurricane” Jackson invented the double uppercut and changed the game forever.

 

Likely to dramatically re-emerge any time now.

 

Yeah it will get there for sure at some point.

 

For me it's not old vs. new, or bigger vs. smaller, it's pre-PEDs vs. PEDs. PEDs affect all divisions, but this is mostly about the heavyweights were it is more obvious. If there was no such thing as PEDs, comparisons could be made to older heavyweight fighters, you could compare Jack Dempsey, or any fighter who has video, to whoever would be champ today. I doubt it would be a 6'3", 215 pounder or a 6'9" 275 pounder either. In the pre-PED eras, the bigger fighters didn't do that well. They occasionally made it to the top but they didn't stay there, they were awkward/clumsy and often didn't have the necessary stamina. If there were no PEDs the champ today would probably be much smaller, more like the pre-PEDs heavyweights.

People haven't changed, the PEDs have allowed athletes to train harder, recover faster, get much stronger, leaner, quicker, etc., and it has opened up heavyweight boxing to bigger people who would probably be too slow, and awkward, and lack stamina without the PEDs. Without PEDs, who knows who would have been the best for the last 60 years? From what I've seen over the years, PEDs don't just affect the physical, they also affect a person's confidence, courage, willingness to fight and endure, and more. Just because someone who uses PEDs has been a dominant fighter does not mean the same guy would be the best if nobody used PEDs. The same guy might be afraid to fight without PEDs.

In boxing, in the heavyweight division, IMO, the cut off is Ali. There was nothing like Ali from the time of Sullivan (no athletic 6'3", 212 pound fighters with speed and endurance) until Ali, then by the 70s there were a number of boxers Ali's size who were also coordinated, strong, quick, agile. By the 80s almost all of them were Ali's size and bigger and many were strong, quick, agile, etc. By the 90s, the 6'5" heavyweights were common place and they just keep getting bigger, stronger, etc. I don't think people have evolved since 1964, but there has been a big change in size and athleticism among heavyweight boxers (and other sports).