Shogun looks to be in decent shape...

I hate when people say **** like "real" Shogun to excuse his loss to Jones. The guy was utterly raped by him and showing up a bit lighter wouldn't have changed anything, just a terrible matchup for him.

 

People are underselling Grif in this fight. Even if the "real" Rua shows up, it's going to be a fight and I wouldn't be surprised if the "real" Grif outlasted the "real" Rua to a decision. A bit guy with good wind can make some stuff happen..

 

When Shogun isn't 110% I have absolutely no interest in watching him. Watching him lose to Griffin and gas against Coleman and Jones is just a waste of time. Shogun out of shape isn't a top 10 205 pounder!

 

Did you see Shogun look out of shape and tired against a shot Mark Coleman?

Did you see Shogun fight at maximum concentration and high intensity for 5 rounds against a peak Lyoto Machida?

Then explain to me why Shogun didn't hit a peak for the Machida fights, compared to how **** he looked against Coleman and Griffin.

He was clearly at a zenith after taking a couple of fights to get back to peak sharpness/fitness.

It is astounding to me how anyone can even debate that the Rua of the Machida fights was not a sharper, better version than the Rua of the Coleman/Griffin fights.

You either can't see very well or have issues you need to address. :good

 

Exactly. Shogun really needs to take a leaf out of other top guys' books like GSP who always, always shows up in 100% physical condition. Turning up flabby and sluggish and turning in shitty performances isn't doing his legacy any good. He's so much better than that.

 

There is alot of nonsense i find in MMA fans more so than boxing fans who are also guilty of this when they talk about peak/prime/real whatever you want to call it. Yes there are trends of decline/improvement and the fight can be beat out of you. End of the day some fighters will just make great fighters look ordinary or worse. There is such a thing as form, somedays you just dont perform aswell as others we all experience this.

Its just another example of the pride fans romantic memory of their favourite fighters. Im not saying that Rua is as good as he was in 05 but he wasnt invincible back then and hes just further from it now.

 

Shogun looked softer in the Jones fight then he probably has an his entire career and rewatch the fight just focusing on Shogun the guy looks weaker then he ever has and was out of breath it appeared within about 2 minutes. I dont give a **** if Jon Jones is a bad matchup and beats him 10 out of 10 times that could be possible but you cant ignore the obvious and that Shogun was in terrible shape.

 

Some people have real, real trouble admitting this very obvious fact though. So many issues at work.

 

How do you know he was in terrible shape? He was on ***** street from the first ten seconds on and anybody would look pretty shitty after getting kneed and nearly KOed, kicked and nearly KOed, spinning back elbowed and nearly KOed, pummeled to the head and body on the floor, and teeped in the face. That all happened in the first round and it was a rare second or two that went by when he wasn't getting smashed.

Even if his cardio was ****, and judging by his gut it probably was, what good would it have done him? Was better conditioning going to magically make that Hail Mary overhand land on Jones' chin? Was it going to help him sweep a massive wrestler with excellent top control and killer elbows? He didn't have time to gas before he got the **** beat out of him, so conditioning was fairly unimportant here.:hi:

 

Dont even bother responding to my post if you arent going to read. I dont give a **** if Shogun being in better shape would help him win or not. The fact is he was in bad shape and that obvious soon as he walked into the octagon. Shogun looked like hed spent 2 months on his ass with the munchies while Jones hadnt missed a day or 1 minute of training. You even admitted his gut was big so there ya go he looked like garbage and just like the other fights where he showed up out of shape he took a beating only difference is Jones aint Mark Coleman. All I ever said was he was out of shape vs Jones which is obvious ive never he would have beat him although its absurd to think he wouldnt atleast been a touch competitve had he been in peak condition.

 

The perfect reply. Excellent post. :happy

 

How in the hell would being in shape have made him any more competitive when he was nearly knocked out in ten seconds? Would being in shape have made that knee miss because that's why he got ****ed up, that and the intense beating put on him immediately afterward.

 

Are you joking now? :huh

I'd have thought that everyone who is a member of this site is well aware that conditioning is a crucial, crucial part of a fighter's powers of recovery.

Of course a fully fit, fully sharp Shogun recovers quicker than the flabby, sluggish version who turned up for the Jones fight... and of course fully fit, fully sharp versions of EVERY FIGHTER recovers quicker than an out of shape version.

I understood this simple truth about 20 minutes after I got interested in combat sports. That you don't seem to know this is as surprising as it is bizarre.

 

Did you know that a cooked turkey would be a better poster then you are ?

 

No, you've got Shogun's nuts so far down your throat that you don't realize that nothing was going to make him competitive. He sucks at wrestling whether he's in shape or not, winging overhands and sloppy Wanderlei-esque hooks don't beat a stiff jab with that much reach advantage, and he never had a chance to recover because right after the knee it was four minutes and fifty seconds of ass whooping. Regardless of what sort of shape he was in he was going to get drug to the floor repeatedly and pummeled mercilessly.

Bringing up conditioning and recovery time for a guy that got beat on continuously for fifteen minutes without offering any sort of offense or resistance is absolutely ridiculous. Did conditioning play a role against Coleman and Griffin? Absolutely, because Shogun had good moments in both fights until he completely **** the bed and gassed. Against Jones that's just a nuthugger's excuse because he got beat up from the very beginning, literally.