Should Floyd Patterson be criticized for for defending his title against

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by SuzieQ49, Jun 19, 2015.


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  1. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    Looks like Summerlin was in line for a shot at patterson


    "Cuban heavyweight Nino Valdes stopped Johnny Summerlin's bid for a possible shot at champion Floyd Patterson with a 5th round knockout last night. Valdes' manager, Bobby Gleason, immediately shouted he would post $5,000 and demand Patterson face the giant Cuban. Summerlin had just staggered Valdes with a right in the middle of the 5th round. The punch stung Valdes into action. Valdes leaped in and pounded Summerlin furiously with both hands to the head before crashing home a right and walking over the falling Summerlin. Summerlin tried to climb to his feet but tumbled back to the canvas and was trying to rise again when referee Johnny Weber tolled the final count." -United Press International
    Summerlin led on two out of the three scorecards through four rounds.


    Detroit promoter C.W. Smith claimed he had assurances befor the bout from Cus D'Amato, Patterson's manager, that Summerlin would have been considered for a title fight had he won.
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 21, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 21, 2015
    #136
  2. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    Machen and London fought in 1961


    "Machen dominated the bout as London was little more than a punching bag for the American. London retired in his corner after 5th round, complaining that his nose felt like it was broken."
    Source: Associated Press, October 18, 1963

    Post fight comments
    "I want to meet Henry Cooper next. We're both rated high and the winner would be the logical man to fight Floyd Patterson for the title." -Eddie Machen

    "The prospect of a fight with Machen gives me no joy at all." -Jim Wicks, Henry Cooper's manager    [/B].
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 21, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 21, 2015
    #137
  3. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    Ernie Terrell W 15 Eddie Machen 1965

    Post fight

    Terrell wants to fight the winner of the Cassius Clay-Sonny Liston title fight, set for Boston May 25. The WBA, which dethroned Clay for signing for the return with Liston, wants him to fight Floyd Patterson, the ex-champion, next.

    But the towering Terrell, prompted by Manager Julie Isaacson, said he won’t fight Patterson because "he never gave anyone a chance    ."
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 21, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 21, 2015
    #138
  4. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    "Zora Folley, 200, from Chandler, Ariz., knocked out Pete Rademacher, 198, Columbus, Ga., in 1:15 of the 4th round. Folley had Pete down four times in all. On the last knockdown, referee Charlie Randolph didn't bother to finish the count. Folley was never in trouble, and it took but one short right chop to the jaw that traveled hardly twelve inches to start Pete on the downhill road. This was in the 3rd round. Another short right to the chin sent him down again. But before the round ended Pete charged Folley into the ropes and they fought savagely seconds after the bell sounded. Rademacher came out with a rush in the 4th but ran straight into a beautiful right cross, and down he went again. Folley closed in, there was a flurry capped by a ripping uppercut to the chin, and that was it." -Associated Press

    This was Rademacher's second pro fight
    Rademacher and Folley met twice as amateurs with both winning a decision

    Olympic Boxing Club matchmaker George Parnassus, immediately after this fight, wired heavyweight champion Floyd Patterson an offer of $250,000 to fight Folley in Los Angeles in September or October of '58
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 21, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 21, 2015
    #139
  5. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    And with two common opponents with Cleveland big Cat Williams Roy Harris recorded exactly the same results. A second round KO and a points win.
     
    choklab, Jun 22, 2015
    choklab, Jun 22, 2015
    #140
  6. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    :good
     
    choklab, Jun 22, 2015
    choklab, Jun 22, 2015
    #141
  7. SuzieQ49

    SuzieQ49 The Manager Full Member

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    Sonny Liston said in 1964

    "Williams is the best I've faced. He hits as hard as I do"
     
    SuzieQ49, Jun 22, 2015
    SuzieQ49, Jun 22, 2015
    #142
  8. mcvey

    mcvey VIP Member Full Member

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    Going into the Ali fight,over 15 years Williams had 71 fights,65 wins lost 5 drawn 1,with 51 kos.
     
    mcvey, Jun 22, 2015
    mcvey, Jun 22, 2015
    #143
  9. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    And against rated fighters Williams was 2-4-1 proving 90% of his 71 fight career was against unrated guys.
     
    choklab, Jun 22, 2015
    choklab, Jun 22, 2015
    #144
  10. choklab

    choklab cocoon of horror Full Member

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    Edit
     
    choklab, Jun 22, 2015
    choklab, Jun 22, 2015
    #145
  11. The Mongoose

    The Mongoose I honor my bets banned

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    Mystery solved, Machen and Folley lost their rating after the draw. Here they are described as the 2 And 3.

    [url]https://news.google.com/newspapers?nid=1314&dat=19580411&id=izFWAAAAIBAJ&sjid=JecDAAAAIBAJ&pg=5321,3180604&hl=en[/url]
     
    The Mongoose, Jun 22, 2015
    The Mongoose, Jun 22, 2015
    #146
  12. The Mongoose

    The Mongoose I honor my bets banned

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    The draw appears to have cost them their rating, just posted an article where Machen and Folley are called the 2 And 3 after the fight.

    And Patterson Harris was always supposed to take place before the winner of Machen vs Volley..see below.
     
    The Mongoose, Jun 22, 2015
    The Mongoose, Jun 22, 2015
    #147
  13. The Mongoose

    The Mongoose I honor my bets banned

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    More to the story.

    Machen vs Folley was an ordered elimanator to determine Patterson's late summer challenger

    The fight is delayed to April over a Machen injury.

    From articles Patterson Harris was already signed and scheduled for June.

    Machen and Zora fight to a draw in a disappointing fight sees them lose their status as The top two. Machen goes out with injury,and can't make a summer fight.

    Patterson Harris was delayed to Aug for reasons I haven't found yet.
     
    The Mongoose, Jun 22, 2015
    The Mongoose, Jun 22, 2015
    #148
  14. edward morbius

    edward morbius Boxing Addict Full Member

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    These two articles by the AP do put a different spin on the whole thing,

    The first article on Rademacher being offered a fight with Folley--

    "Pete Rademacher . . . is being showered with offers to fight third-ranked Zora Folley."

    "Folley and second-ranked Eddie Machen went to a 12-round draw last night in San Francisco."

    Interesting to me also is that there is so much apparent demand for a Folley-Rademacher fight with several promoters in the bidding.

    The second article--

    "The dull Cow Palace fight between Machen, number 1 contender, and Folley, ranked #2, was televised nationally."

    Douglas Hayden of the California State Boxing Commission is quoted--

    "It is hard to believe they are potential champions. They acted half scared to death of each other."

    "Patterson's manager, Cus D'Amato, says 'No comment' when queried about fighting Folley. He ruled out Machen on the grounds he once had a chance for a title fight but turned it down."

    *I was wondering about the discrepancy about the ratings, but it might well be that the NBA held their quarterly ratings up until the results of Folley-Machen fights could be factored in, and then dropped then both a notch. I have never seen a film, but the fight seems to have been a real stinker and was seen by the whole country.

    Who then was the number one contender as of April 10?

    More research is needed, but it is possible it was Harris. He still had a perfect record. Miteff had beaten Valdes in February, which probably dropped his prestige for a bit. Besmanoff, who had been beaten by Harris, outpointed the 5th ranked McMurtry in February. Off another article I read, Harris was training in the army, probably for the National Guard. That shouldn't have been held against him.
     
    edward morbius, Jun 22, 2015
    edward morbius, Jun 22, 2015
    #149
  15. The Mongoose

    The Mongoose I honor my bets banned

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    Harris was likely #1, or there was no #1.

    Also interesting that Harris fight was signed after Folley and Machen was delayed.

    Patterson was going to be stripped if he made no defense.

    The intention was Harris in June to prevent a stripping and than the winner of the delayed Machen vs Folley.
     
    The Mongoose, Jun 22, 2015
    The Mongoose, Jun 22, 2015
    #150
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