Should titles be allowed to be fought for at catchweights?

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by demigawd, Jan 11, 2010.


  1. dublynflya

    dublynflya Stand your ground Son!! Full Member

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    I believe that you are exactly right, however one must consider the fact that the p4p best fighter on Earth is asking his opponents to "Weigh in" at the weight he requests. That in some respects trivialises the p4p laurel that almost all of us boxing fans have bestowed upon Manny.

    Surely all fans of boxing in general and Pacquaio in particular wish for him to dispense with such "Weigh-in" restrictions.

    The weigh-in clause is Manny's demand, not Clottey's. But Joshua will not refuse because he does not want to miss out on the big pay-day and were he to refuse to adhere to Manny's "Weigh in clause" Pacquiao would probably not fight him. So in fact respect Manny is not holding a gun to Clottey's head, he is holding a fat cheque in it's place.
     
  2. LukeO

    LukeO Erik Morales is God Full Member

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    When did arum say there is no catch weight?
     
  3. Staff

    Staff New Member Full Member

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    If Manny comes in lower than 147 that is his business but him and Roach shouldn't make Clottey come under to 144.
     
  4. demigawd

    demigawd Boxing Addict Full Member

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    That's not bull****. That's currently how it works. But should it continue to work that way?

    To any boxing historians reading this. How many times have we seen a champion impose a catchweight on a challenger with the champion's title on the line? I know there were several cases where a challenger requested a catchweight of the champion (SRL did that a few times), and there are lots of cases where two fighters fight at catchweights for no title. But I can't think of any cases off-hand where a champion required a catchweight of a challenger. Anybody know?
     
  5. AffectedToaster

    AffectedToaster Well-Known Member Full Member

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    if your not willing to fight someone that weighs 147 than u shouldn't be allowed to call yourself a welterweight champion imo.
     
  6. lewishamboy

    lewishamboy Styles Impetuous Full Member

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    Catchweights should not be allowed in world title fights.
     
  7. crimson

    crimson Boxing Addict banned

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    You misunderstand the term limit. Limit in this case refers to a the range where 141 is the MINIMUM POSSIBLE LIMIT and 147 is the MAXIMUM POSSIBLE LIMIT. Anything between that is legal.
     
  8. Cobbler

    Cobbler Shoemaker To The Stars Full Member

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    Nobody is circumventing anything. A mandatory defence has rules attached to it. A voluntary defence is voluntary and the champion is free to make specifications (location, purse split, weight included) that he is not free to make in a mandatory defence.

    How do you actually plan to enforce this anyway? If Clotty turned up at the weigh in and weighed in at 144, what would happen? Would the fight be made a non-title fight?
     
  9. demigawd

    demigawd Boxing Addict Full Member

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    No, I understand perfectly. In fact, there isn't a minimum weight at all, just a maximum weight. If a flyweight wants to fight for the welterweight title while not weighting any higher than his normal weight, then he's perfectly allowed to do so.

    So I'm perfectly clear on that.

    It's also not my point.

    My point is should it be legal for a boxer to set a LIMIT that's under the LIMIT established by the organization sanctioning the title. This has nothing to do with a valid weight range and everything to do with a valid weight limit. If one fighter *chooses* to come in below the limit of his own free will, that's one thing. If a champion *requires* a challenger to come in below the LIMIT in order to challenge for a title with a higher limit, it should lose its sanctioning.

    See what I'm saying now?
     
  10. Hermit

    Hermit Loyal Member banned

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    Cotto said he would not put his title on the line and the ABC said it WAS on the line. What then? After he had signed? That sux. They just wanted a piece of Manny, the damned blood suckers.....
     
  11. demigawd

    demigawd Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Yeah, I hear you. That's currently what the rules state. But given the potential for abuse, as we may possibly be seeing with Pacquiao here, I think it's valid to question whether those rules should be changed.

    It's circumventing because you're using your position as champion to lower the limit, in direct opposition to the limit of that weight class. I'm not saying that Clottey coming in at 144 should make it a non-title bout. I'm saying that Clottey coming in at 147 should't prevent them from fighting for a title that was established with a 147 limit. And I'm saying that should be written into the rules to prevent abuse from champions to modify the limits on voluntary fights, which make up anywhere from 66% to 75% of a champion's reign.

    In short, should the alphabet organizations adopt verbage in their rules and regulations similar to this:

    The Champion may not independently regulate, specify or otherwise limit the weight of his opponent beyond the limits and guidelines established by the organization. Doing so will result in the Organization's withdrawal of title sanctioning and no championship will be at stake.
     
  12. Hermit

    Hermit Loyal Member banned

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    Start weighing two weeks out and this problem disappears.
     
  13. Cobbler

    Cobbler Shoemaker To The Stars Full Member

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    Who says that it would?

    Contractual penalties for exceeding an agreed weight limit are usually financial.
     
  14. demigawd

    demigawd Boxing Addict Full Member

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    Sure, and/or the other party can cancel the fight on those grounds.

    By stating in the sanctioning bodies rules that weight stipulations are no longer accepted in championship-sanctioned contracts, it protects a fighter from being financially penalized for doing what is very much within the rules. The point is there shouldn't be *any* penalty for Clottey coming in over 144lbs but under 147, but until the rules change, a boxer has the extraordinary power to impose a penalty.
     
  15. Cobbler

    Cobbler Shoemaker To The Stars Full Member

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    Why not impose rules on what purse splits can be agreed in voluntary defences to prevent a fighter being 'financially penalised' for challenging for a title? Otherwise a champion could demand a 95%/5% purse split.