SHW's Ruined HW Boxing

Discussion in 'World Boxing Forum' started by dogcatcher, Jul 3, 2013.


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  1. dogcatcher

    dogcatcher Active Member Full Member

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    Since Lennox Lewis and now the Klitchko brothers have come to dominate what I would call standard sized HW's, they have ruined the sport for men who are around 215 and below. (Bowe never quit reached his potential but was one of the 1st SHW's near the top)

    A whole division of competitors is deprived of the opportunity to shine. The way it is now the Ali's, Tyson's, Holyfields, Frazier's etc. would never have risen to show the abilities they truly possessed. All of them could easily have been 215 lbs if that division existed. (some may have been skilled enough to beat those SHW's , but still heavily disadvantaged).

    If the 215 under and 215 and over division separating HW and SHW were put in place there would be a flourishing HW division and a fast dying SHW due to lack of competition. So because a couple of oversized talents exist all other talented (HW's) suffer. I say it's time to fix this **** and make it right by creating the division SHW.

    I'm not hating on these guys but why do all the lower weights get opportunities sometimes only a few pounds apart, but the HW's have to give away massive size differences?
     
    dogcatcher, Jul 3, 2013
    dogcatcher, Jul 3, 2013
    #1
  2. Koba

    Koba Whimsical Inactivisist Full Member

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    I think that that was pretty much the point of Cruiser. It's basically a 25lb weight class for the smaller end of HW.

    I'm not convinced boxing needs more weight classes, but if the guys are really getting bigger on the whole how bout taking CW upto 210lbs - a nice round 15st. I think that could work.

    Problem is of course that HW is always gonna be the prestige division to the general public, so I wouldn't count on either 210-215lb option generating too much interest. Most fighters gonna go where the money is.
     
    Koba, Jul 3, 2013
    Koba, Jul 3, 2013
    #2
  3. RememberingC.S.

    RememberingC.S. Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The solution is already working in the olympics, where the heavyweights and superheavyweights category are separated from years.

    But the reason it will NEVER be made a superHW division, is hystorical: that would immediately disqualify the HW division, even peoples ignorant about boxing would realize that the past glories wouldn't have been competitive, swince they were fighting 1, 2, and even 3 weight catecgories below.
    This is the only reason, it's sad, but a super HW division will never be made, in my opinion.
     
    RememberingC.S., Jul 3, 2013
    RememberingC.S., Jul 3, 2013
    #3
  4. Vergilius

    Vergilius Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The talent pool is diluted enough without a super HW division. A new HW division with a limit of 215 would be largely void of talent (there would be Haye, Povetkin and Adamek and that's it) and the shw division would be the same (Klitschko, Fury and Helenius). Splitting what Little talent there is at HW into separate divisions is a horrible idea.
     
    Vergilius, Jul 3, 2013
    Vergilius, Jul 3, 2013
    #4
  5. Loudon

    Loudon Loyal Member Full Member

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    They do not play in the same league? :lol:
     
    Loudon, Jul 3, 2013
    Loudon, Jul 3, 2013
    #5
  6. TERRYTIBBS

    TERRYTIBBS Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    Once you get over 15 stone weight isnt such a big factor
     
    TERRYTIBBS, Jul 3, 2013
    TERRYTIBBS, Jul 3, 2013
    #6
  7. Espin88

    Espin88 Boxing Addict Full Member

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    The last thing boxing needs is another weight category, just push light heavy upto 185lbs and cruiser upto 210lbs.
     
    Espin88, Jul 3, 2013
    Espin88, Jul 3, 2013
    #7
  8. Shawn Kemp

    Shawn Kemp Guest

    It is find the way it is . The Heayvweight division just sucks and the Klits don't dominate anything besides hand picking their opponents and being on PEDS. Lewis didn't dominate anything either. He struggled like hell against the "small" washed up Holyfield and got iced by Rahman and McCall fighters he are taller than.

    Ali isn't in the same league as Tyson? Ali is bigger than Tyson in height and similar in weight. So is Frazier.

    Marciano and Dempsey are another story. They aren't heavyweights by modern standards.
     
    Shawn Kemp, Jul 3, 2013
    Shawn Kemp, Jul 3, 2013
    #8
  9. Decker

    Decker Boxing Addict Full Member

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    :good, :good, and :good. Actually the entire post is spot on.
     
    Decker, Jul 3, 2013
    Decker, Jul 3, 2013
    #9
  10. Decker

    Decker Boxing Addict Full Member

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    You're part of the "I have my undies all twisted b/c US HWs no longer dominate" fandom. If the K bros or LL "don't dominate anything", who the hell did Ali or J Louis or older US HWs dominate? Beefed up LHWs to CWs or clumsy big oaf HWs like Buddy Bear or Tony Galento or Buster Mathis? :lol:

    Even in J Louis era they called most of his opponents "the bum of the month". Ali had a similar MO, with bouts vs such luminaries as Rudi Lubbers, Wepner, Coopman, Dunn, Evangelista, Spinks x2 :-( Today none of those fighters could even be fringe HW contenders. And except for the oaf Wepner, in this era the rest of them would be CWs or small HWs. Ali went life & death w/slow starting bob & plod Frazier and chinny Norton. Frazier & Norton would be blasted out of the ring :dead by LL or either K bro.

    Ali had hell w/JF 3 times. Prime - short as it was - Tyson beats Frazier and most of the time beats Ali. MT on a bad night might lose by decision.

    Yes. Also J Johnson was huge in his day at 200lb, J Louis prime was about 200lb. Today they're CWs, not HWs. Create a SHW div. and most past HWs - including Ali - become just HWs :D
     
    Decker, Jul 3, 2013
    Decker, Jul 3, 2013
    #10
  11. doylexxx

    doylexxx Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    holyfield beat valuev at 45 ****ing years old

    he beat foreman and bowe when prime

    haye beat valuev

    haye will beat fury

    adamek beat grant

    Holyfield at 37 damn near beat Prime lewis

    Klits and Lennox were good thats why they win

    tyson would chop both down in his prime

    this superheavyweigh stuff is pure nonsense

    the other HWs not named Klitschko are garbage thats the real problem
     
    doylexxx, Jul 3, 2013
    doylexxx, Jul 3, 2013
    #11
  12. kirk

    kirk l l l Staff Member

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    No, if a fighter cant beat a SHW, its because they aren't that good, not because they are being 'kept down' by all the SHW's around today. Unless you are talking about all the cruisers who are moving up to heavy for the paydays.

    Theres no reason a guy like Jennings shouldn't be able to beat Price, Fury, Valuev, Grant, Fields, ect. In fact, some of the best prospects today aren't SHW's, and would favor over most of the bigger heavyweights outside of the klits.


    The SHW's are hardly taking over, and Wlad being dominant right now has as much to do with his quality, as his size. To chalk it up to just his size is being completely ignorant to the state of todays division.
     
    kirk, Jul 3, 2013
    kirk, Jul 3, 2013
    #12
  13. dbouziane

    dbouziane ............. Full Member

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    i totally disagree. there just hasnt been any ass kicking 225lb wrecking balls to come through in quite a long time.

    at 6'3" 220-225, Ali would toy with the entire "SHW" division as it stands today.
     
    dbouziane, Jul 3, 2013
    dbouziane, Jul 3, 2013
    #13
  14. damian38

    damian38 BigDramaShow Full Member

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    i agree that a 210 lb guy fighting a 250 lb opponent has a severe disadvantage, but you can't write him off just because of size, didn't 213 lbs Holyfield drop a 240 lbs hard chinned Bowe? or most recently, didn't 254 lbs great HW hope Tyson Fury get dropped by a 210 lbs feather fisted Steve Cunningham?
     
    damian38, Jul 3, 2013
    damian38, Jul 3, 2013
    #14
  15. ludwig

    ludwig Boxing Addict Full Member

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    make 225 the upper limit for heavyweight, and everything over that super heavyweight.
     
    ludwig, Jul 3, 2013
    ludwig, Jul 3, 2013
    #15
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