So, Hopkin's Wins Over ATG Welterweights...

Monzon's MW reign was superior to Hopkins's by a fair amount in that he faced the better competition unquestionably and proved himself to be head and shoulders above his peers. The only thing that pulls Hopkins even in some people's eyes is his work at LHW, which really only includes a win over a weight drained and overall mediocre Tarver. Not quite the same as having to face a Bob Foster type. I'll stick to rating Monzon ahead.

 

Monzon was undefeated in world title bouts. Monzon has no jermain taylors on his record. monzon never punked out and tried to cheat when he got tired. Monzon let his hands go in trying to win,unlike hopkins v jones. I dont care that hopkins went up in weight,he fought the ordinary tarver,the lt middle wright and lost to calzaghe. At lt heavy he has done nothing...
Hopkins is technically brilliant but he is boring,doesnt take risks to secure wins and would fall short against the better fighters,eg jones....

 

This is a good point Janitor.

Hopkins' middleweight resume may not be quite as deep as Monzon's, but this does allow him to compete in terms of overall greatness.

 

He's a pretty average fighter IMO.The only really good thing about him was his power.

Very few good lightheavweights are going to be in give and take battles with ancient blown up Glen Johnson like Tarver was.

 

The weight-drained version Hopkins faced was most certainly mediocre, yes. Just because someone's name is recognized doesn't make them a great, or even especially good fighter. Tarver has always been limited as a fighter, and that night he was outclassed in his own speciality, which is counter-punching.

 

for a guy whos seriousely knowledgable like yourself, you seem to make way to many exuses for a fighter being "past his prime, green, out of shape, injured, not at his best bla bla bla"...... I must confess I do this myself too, but u seem to do it more than anyone. I always hear u trying to justify a losing performance by saying the fighter wasnt at his best.

 

Tough?

What am I supposed to say? I'm a realist, I judge by what I see and what I know, I don't pretend everyone's 100% equal as soon as they step into the ring. Some don't like to hear excuses no matter how legitimate, I'm not one of those people.

And once again, Tarver was never anything special.

 

I think I had the hopkins oscar fight dead even after 8 rounds, pretty boring fight oscar led early then hopkins took over. pretty even though.

 

The difference physically was like 'night and day'. Coming in on the limit isn't needed if your not a natural and grown into the weight. De La Hoya certainly learned his lesson.

 

Exactly, - i'm not sure where i rate either P4P but Hopkins performances at higher weights certainly adds to his ranking. Strictly as Middleweights obviously not.

 

I had Hopkins drawing with Winky Wright and I thought that given the weight disparity, Wright actually showed he was the better fighter p4p at the time.

I never thought much of Tarver, so I don't really think Hopkins' performance, although impressive, meant that much in the big scheme of things.

Ironically, I felt that Hopkins fought the best he had in years against Calzaghe in losing a close decision.

Ultimately, I think Hopkins' losses to Jermain Taylor (although close and arguable both ways) really hurt him. Not so much because Taylor isn't that great, which is true enough, but because of the way Hopkins fought. He basically had two shots at him and both times fought cautious half the fight, basically giving rounds, and ultimately the fights away. An ATG should have chanced his arm and gone harder than what Hopkins did. I KNOW Carlos Monzon would have.