So if Calzaghe retires, Were does he stand in the All-Time list ?

Top 5

 

with who? he asks fully expecting a stupid answer (this should be interesting)

 

I've not labeled an insult to you - I'd appreciate the same curtesy - masked insult, implied insult or even mass aimed insult.

Robin Reid - Joe broke his hand early on in the fight. He fought a vast majority of the fight with a broken hand (so one handed really), and really still deserved the win. This was the Robin Reid who also should have been the unified champ (Sven Ottke). When you take the full picture into consideration - it's not such a poor performance.

Joe went the distance with Rick Thornberry and Starie - Both Warren and Joe lacked confidence - Warren through a nature of overprotectiveness, and Joe through self doubt that will have been increased by the lack of appreciation he was receiving across the board - understandable, great promise never materialised (Warren's overprotectiveness didnt help matters in this regard).

Roy Jones also went the distance with unheralded fighters during his peak. Means little - although Jones didnt have the hand injuries that bothered Joe.

You're telling me his speed has improved? I'd seriously intend to disagree - but my telling you so will not change your opinion. I'd merely like to point out that it's false (according to the film footage), and that it's very rare for a fighter to be faster mid-late 30's, than he is in his 20's-early 30's. His stamina has always been of an extremely high calibre - he's maintained an almost unprecedented level of fitness to still be able to fight at that pace, at that workrate - for so long at the top level at his age.

Sure - his experience improved, and he helped nurture that desire to get into slugfests - but his mental prime is now - mentally he's on top of the world, and no one will touch him. Physically - that was a long time ago.

So lets take recent wins from Lacy onwards - Bika isnt looking that bad a win as he's showing signs of being a good fighter at 168, and a challenge for anyone - I'd love to see him given another title shot - I feel he'd have a solid - not great, but solid chance of doing really really well.

Kessler - future of 168, Joe won wide UD. Kessler has the chance to achieve great things in what appears to be one of the hottest divisions in boxing in terms of depth at the top 10-15. Coincidentally - this so called depth only appears after Joe moves on to pastures new... Maybe it wasn't such a weak division after all....

Bhop - Joe got majorly criticised for picking on Bhop, everyone said he'd be schooled - he won comfortably on many of the more respected posters scorecards - and more critically - 2 of the 3 judges at ringside. Bhop was then considered shot as he looked gassed, and was scheduled to fight pavlik - the man who everyone accused Joe of ducking, and was tipped to beat Joe. Bhop showed exactly what life in the upper echelons of boxing is like - the Ghost got Busted.

Jones - pretty much shot fighter - doesnt really make much difference.

Pac has 2 decisions he was considered to be very lucky to have, loss against a past prime morales, wins against shot barrera and morales. and a win against the weakest champion in 135 - he then decided to 'side-step' everyone else at that division to fight Hoya to "make history" (where i right history - you read MONEY), and his career will be over after this fight - win or lose.

JMM - two losses to pac - he was unlucky, could have won - yet failed to pull out the win in both of those fights. (Joe has always pulled out the win - no matter the circumstance). He then moved up to beat a Casamayor who to be honest - that fight should not get any more credit than beating a shot Jones. Casa was considered shot after Cruz - shouldn't be champion - by near miracle still is. Was losing on points to KATSIDIS - who's not a great boxer by any means, before landing a great shot to get the win - fair play by casa - still shot. Props to JMM for being the first to stop him, but that's it.

*edit* I'd also like to add that Joe didnt stay with Warren to make money - he wasnt making much, and Warren was virtually blackmailing him into staying in his ranks.

 

1.Robinson
2.Louis
3.Ali
4.Pep
5.JC

 

P4P not sure, 168 behind Jones and Toney for sure and posibily behind Benn, Eubank and Collins.

 

what makes a poster respected in your eyes? that they agree with you on their scores or because you say they are?:roll:

 

and why does joe deserve to be up with these legends of the sport? joe would be lucky if they let him get a whiff of their jockstrap

 

You destroyed any credibility you had with that statement.

 

haha i must be coming down in the world if pugilist64 tells me i have no credibility. This coming from a guy who has joe calzaghe in his top 5
ok you've amused me and diverted my attention from my question for long enough care to answer my question? or are there limits to the amount of **** you can spout in one day

 

Want to find a single person on this site who doesnt respect Brooklyn, KG0208 or sues2nd?

They showed their ability over the course of fights and time, and were able to partake in some of the better debates in boxing on this forum. They were also amongst the classiest of posters - never going all out insulting, just giving sound, brilliant boxing analysis to back up their points.

Ask Sean, Decebal, McGrain - those guys were a class above 99% of what is on this forum now. I've also disagreed with them on scorecards many a time - doesnt mean I still don't respect them.

 

again that is purely subjective because its your opinion and others still doesnt mean its fact and doesnt mean we can take everything they say as fact. Everything on this board should be taken with a pinch of salt

 

Bhop's network (you can hardly call HBO Joe's can you) gave it far wider to Joe. Also consider the experience and the actual abiltiies of the analysis' of the two networks...

He didnt nearly knock him down - joe was off balance a little, but he is a lot of the time due to his movement. Also - you might notice that was the round i gave to hopkins...

and I didnt give a single round to either fighter i couldnt see. I posted my card - if you disagree - fine, do not insult me for it, especially when you will refrain from posting your own scorecard.

This is a boxing forum where people are allowed to debate boxing - great. Why insult other people because they disagree from you? THAT smells of insecurities to me.

 

you can hardly call it hops network he's had plenty of quarrels and disputes with HBO over the years and harold ledderman is bias to the point of blind against hopkins he scored the winky fight a draw for christ sake

 

Fair enough - in that case, anything in life is subjective to an extent.

Look them up - read their posts.

Sues2nd is great for giving prefight analysis. This is his prefight analysis for Bhop/Joe.

http://www.eastsideboxing.com/forum/showthread.php?t=59827

I'd also - just for the sake of fun, read some of the posts from the other guys - they were great posters to be around - in my opinion of course

 

more Bhop's than Joe's at that point. Either way - my point about the experience of the two networks stand.