Sonny Liston had a great chin

Very good video, I've always consider Liston to have a granite chin, I'd rate it 9/10 and I don't care what anybody spouts about Ali II - that "KO" was a genuine dive.

Agreed, he especially showed tremendous chin when he took huge bombs for 19 brutal rounds of war against devastating puncher Razor Ruddock.
I believe that if he was subjected to the big punches Lyle floored young Foreman with twice, Tyson would not have hit the canvas (although I admit old Foreman would have took them without dropping too).

 

:huh You're the one that started discussing semantics! We're all aware of what the facts are - what the film shows. You started the discussion on meaning, and what being hit hard or hit flush meant.

 

:-(

 

Sometimes you get hit by a shot on the side of the head or on a sweet spot that takes away your equilibrium and when you're caught cold its far worse.

Walcotts innept refereeing was what stopped the fight though

 

Everybody recognises that Ali's power was not great. He got lots of stoppages because he was a ****ing amazing fighter who could land pretty much whatever he wanted, consistently, against lesser opposition - through accumulation. He often threw slappy arm punches. Apart from maybe Folley, I can't remember Ali stopping anyone through anything other than a consistent barrage of shots.

 

I'd agree with that, when ALi sits on his shots they hurt, not a brutal puncher by any means

Rewatching Ali-Liston 2, I think it may well be a genuine concussion, he was timing right hand after right hand flush, the punch that put him down didn't look brutal but it was fast precise well turned over, he shifted all his weight to his left leg and the other rights may have already dizzied Liston a little, plus he didn't see it coming. The way he collapses seems natural

 

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=96MYTogoXLc&feature=related[/ame]

 

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ru9i16tiFe0[/ame]

 

He also seems to lose his sense of equilibrium, his legs look shakey when he gets up plus he also pulls a 'Berbick' falling back down, if he did fake it he was doing quite a bit of theatrics

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uzWynvBLJ4I[/ame]

 

Bonavena was knackered by that stage. Falling around all over the place.

 

No, it's a totally objective statement.
un·der·whelm (

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)tr.v. un·der·whelmed, un·der·whelm·ing, un·der·whelms To fail to excite, stimulate, or impress.

Ali's power was just that. People attacked him for not having a punch. It did not excite or impress. It was one of his lesser attributes.