Sonny Liston - Had To Lose In Lewiston, Maine

This is not true. If you look at the pattern of Liston's footwork he always took the big long step, followed by a short little stutter-hop.
He does exactly the same thing, and then decides to go down.

It's grasping at straws to claim that Ali's punch caused the little stutter step, because Liston did that every time after the long step.

Watch the whole 'fight' again. Liston lifts his foot in a short step after every long step he makes with that front foot.

But I know you're just repeating something you read elsewhere anyway. :good

 

it was a great counter punch and too fast for most to see. so let's see this beautiful pin point shot in slow motion. liston foot comes off the floor so his balance has gone and he goes down. legit knockdown but sonny quits for the 2nd time once he's down - the rolling around seems a bit too much like play acting. look at the rebound shock of the punch back to ali's pecs - perfect timed shot.

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Still no proof of a fix.

If anyone can prove it, feel free.

 

The lead foot lift from that punch is well documented. You have that SI article and formal frame by frame analysis of the fight. If you want to throw all that out, dont know why you would unless you have other motives then just Chuvalos observation that Listons eyes were shifting side to side when he was down shows that he was potentially very hurt. If your that much an Ali hater and want to throw all of this out then you have the formal NY state investigation of the second fight AND the formal investigation of the first fight my Florida State. BOTH concluded there was no evidence of a fix. Now if you then want to ignore all of this evidence then I would suggest the issue is with YOU. Finally just look at the historic scope of the fights. Ali as we all know went on to be, to this very day, rated by most as the best hwt champion ever. Everyone lists him at the very least in the top 2. Here he is fighting an old Liston after soundly beating him in Miami.....why fix the fight? Why would Liston train sooo very hard to get in shape for the fight if the fix was in? The truth is looking back on both fights it was the classic example of a young future ATG fighting the old champion and beating him soundly. Ali was the one on the way up and Liston was certainly on his way down. By what magical method was Lston going to catch Ali and knock him out in either fight? If was quite obvious from the opening bell of both fights that Ali was just too quick for Liston. He was falling all over himself trying to land a clean shot.

 

Absolutely spot on that's something that people ignore. Whatever did happen certainly didn't involve Ali.

 

Clay was surprised Liston went down as early as he did.

He wasn't ready for it and almost blew the cover.

In an interview before he even left the ring, he didn't know if he had hit him with a left hook or a right cross. He didn't have a clue why Liston went down

I think the ending had been rehearsed and Liston strayed from the script.

 

BillB is probably the most gullibe poster on here. I bet he believes all consiracy theories.

 

Don't be silly

 

NY state boxing commission and Miami state authorities investigates both bouts. No evidence of a fix was found.

 

Ignore the facts and emphasize the speculation. Read the SI article.... were they in on the fix also? If what you say was true and the NY state commission was that much anti Liston they would have found a fix if there were evidence of one. Funny you have lots of info/lies you post but tell everyone.....

Why did you never mention the two formal investigations that found no evidence of a fix?

Why did not not mention the technical analysis of the second bout where the film was analyzed frame by frame and concluded that Liston was indeed koed?

Why did you not mention Chuvalos comment that Listons eyes were darting side to side when he was down evidence of brain trauma?

Why did you not mention that Patterson, Fleischer, Walcott, SI reporters, Torres, and many others were at ringside, saw the punch land and all stated the ko was legit?

So you ignore formal investigations and eye witness testimony but insist upon writing about fringe, non specific information, pure speculation that needs to be interpreted by a very imaginative thought process? Bottom line....you don't kill yourself in training if there is to be a fix and if there is a fix especially by such an unpopular fighter as Liston it would be exposed in a formal investigation. Result of both investigations, Miami and NY....no evidence of a fix was found.