Sonny Liston v.s Joe Frazier

Flabby gut, you made an interesting comparison there about the Quarry of the Spenser and Lyle fights. You may be right about Jerry winning but I don't think so because of Liston's big jab and that Jerry wouldn't hurt the Liston of the Cleaveland Williams fights. Mac Foster kept Jerry at bay until he was ko'd with nothing but his short repeated jabs and Jerry simply had no answer until he saw that opening and crushed Mac. I can't see Jerry avoiding being busted up from Liston's jab.

 

Frazier Tko 8 Liston.He would not be intimidated and that would be half the battle.

 

though i am amazed that u think foreman is so bad, i agree that liston would have probably ko'd frazier in 1......his equal power mixed with his straighter punches would have found joe even earlier........a nightmare of a fight for smoking joe

 

Liston lost four times to guys who stayed away,that was never in Smokin Joe;s programing.Frazier comes straight at Sonny,and gets pounded on.

 

Liston KO 6.

 

Frazier KO10 Liston.


I think the Liston-Foreman comparison is extremely imaginative and uninformed. Also, I tend to agree that Frazier was used up by the time of Foreman I, let alone II.

 

joe frazier had a chance to fight liston on his way up and did'nt.why?because sonny was dangerous evan after he was beaten by ali and the people handling frazier knew better.joes' style was all wrong to beat liston.sonny would hold him off with an 84 in.reach and hit him almost at will with straight rights, with joe was prone to his entire carrer and with his monster left hook.evan with joes'bobbing style he was still easy to hit.i don't see this fight going 6 rds.with sonny winning via ko.thanks.

 

That's right, I forgot. Liston beats everyone. At once. With one hand tied behind his back.

Or is it that Liston faced nowhere near the level of competition Frazier did and on that record are judgements passed.

I'll second what Mr. Magoo above stated so well, that no one know who wins against two ATG's, that Frazier is vastly under-rated despite a great resume, and lastly, that Liston is chronically over-rated. Even though most concede he is in consideration as a top-10 AT heavy, certain folks want to deify him.

 

I'd pick Liston by K.O around the 9th.

Joe would come straigt at Liston, and while his perpetual motion would serve him well, I feel Sonny had too good and too stiff a jab to not rattle Joe. Frazier routinely took punches getting inside, that was part of the job, and I simply don't see him taking Liston's jab + follow-up all night long.

It would be a great match.

 

Sonny Liston by 4th round TKO.

Joe would get destroyed moving forward vs Sonny Liston. The jab would hurt him, the uppercuts and hooks would put him down. Bad matchup for Smoking Joe. Liston is too big, too strong, had good boxing skills and put some punches together very well for a big man.

Frazier isn't exactly a great dancer. He's a coming forward machine. He can do it only one way. So against a faster or bigger or stronger guy with explosive power, his chances aren't good. He was tailor made for guys like Foreman, Lewis, Liston, big guys with long range and great power.

Joe Frazier could fight on even terms with shorter punchers like him... Marciano, Dempsey, Tyson.

However he would have a better chances versus the likes of Ali, Holmes, Johnson, Tunney, Charles, putting pressure on them without the danger of being knocked.

 

This fight is tough. Frazier definently gets dropped early and maybe multiple times. Liston was a big time puncher and his jab would stop Frazier in his tracks many times.

Theres two scenarios I see playing out, either Liston stops Frazier early, or Frazier is able to rally back, winning the mid to late rounds and winning by UD.

I would favor the latter. Frazier is able to outwork the slower Liston and win by UD after getting beat up the first 4 rounds.

 

I agree, Frazier is often under rated because he was stopped by arguably the most powerful puncher in history. Frazier holds a win over a guy who made Liston quit and has the overall better resume. Liston's best win is over Floyd Patterson who is a good win but had a style that Liston would devour. Other than that, his resume consists of Machen, Folley, Williams as the best fighters who are all good fighters but fairly ordinary contenders. Liston is supposed to be this big, invincible monster but lost to Marty Marshall early in his career and struggled with Machen who was destroyed by Ingo.

 

As far as I can recall, the only two guys to drop Frazier were Foreman and Bonavena. He got up six times against Foreman and wasn't about to quit. He got off the deck twice early on to Bonavena and went on to outpoint him and win a decision. He won a 15 round decision over Bonavena in a championship fight. Bonavena could punch - I remember him landing a hook on Ali that staggered him badly. Guys like Quarry and Chuvalo never hurt Frazier, and guys like Ellis, Ali, Mathis, and Bugner never decked him either. That said, Foreman showed that a big, devastating puncher could take him out. I like Frazier as a fighter overall better than Liston, but that said, I think this is a very bad matchup for Joe, who would move right into Liston's power punching zone, and boy could Sonny punch. Keep in mind, the only guys to ever defeat or give Sonny trouble were quick boxer types. Outside was the way to beat Sonny, but Joe was an inside fighter.

 

I agree with this, I think it is a more sober analysis than some of the previous ones.

Foremans pummeling of Frazier is clear in all our minds, but it was THE performance of Foremans career - a truly staggering, awe-inspiring cumulative battering from a man who would become known as a destroyer over the course of 4 decades, felling generation after generation of HWs.

Foreman was a very hungry, deadly accurate, superbly conditioned wrecking machine on that night AND Frazier was off, both physically and mentally.

Its a stretch for me to say anyone else can KO1 or 2 a prime Frazier.