Sonny Liston vs Lennox Lewis

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by swagdelfadeel, Dec 6, 2015.



  1. Big Ukrainian

    Big Ukrainian Boxing Junkie Full Member

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    The Lewis' hate is ridiculous.

    Over the last 35 years only Lennox, Tyson and Klitsckos got so many haters.

    Lennox is accused of 'glass jaw'

    Tyson is accused of 'being extremely overrated', 'never overcame adversity' etc

    Vitali is accused of 'weak opposition'

    Wlad is accused of 'glass jaw and clinching'

    But haters mean you're popular, so there's the other side of it :)
     
  2. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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  3. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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  4. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    So your 3 experts are Robert Polis, Graham Houston and Andrew Eisele.

    What makes these 3 experts in your opinion?
     
  5. Vanboxingfan

    Vanboxingfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Meaningless.

    You have to consider that this is a p4p list, not an absolute list. If it were just based on who hits the hardest, do you think anyone but heavies would be occupying the first 20-30 spots? Do you really think Jimmy Wilde hits harder than Lewis and Liston?

    If you do you're truly delusional.

    As for p4p I don't have a huge problem with someone ranking Sonny ahead of Lennox on a p4p basis, but that wouldn't mean Sonny hits harder, it would only mean that if they weighed the same, Sonny would hit harder.
     
  6. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    You're right, Graham Houston has only covered boxing for 53 years.
     
  7. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    I'm right about what? That Lewis hits harder than Liston?
     
  8. Vanboxingfan

    Vanboxingfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    I don't have a huge problem with that list, although I disagree that in an absolute sense, that Dempsey, Marciano, and Frazier hit harder than Lewis. P4p I wouldn't argue it though.

    But either way, when you're talking about anyone in the top 10 in the context of something nobody can really prove one way or another, it's all roughly in the same ball park.

    And power alone doesn't mean all that much, if it did, Shavers would have had a much better record than he does.

    But the fact you clearly used a p4p list, which included Jimmy Wilde, to support your argument as to who hit harder between Lewis and Liston, either shows desperation or a clear lack of understanding of what you're talking about. Take your pick.
     
  9. Vanboxingfan

    Vanboxingfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    What are you talking about, you cited three experts to support your theory and one of those "experts" produced a P4P list of punchers, which has zero relevancy to this discussion. But apparently you can't even grasp this.
     
  10. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    My gut feeling is that there was not a lot between them either way.
     
  11. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Yes, Lewis hit very hard. He did have considerable power However, Common opponents of Lewis and Old Foreman all stated Foreman hit hardest. But common opponents of PRIME Foreman and Liston all said Liston hit harder. And, more punching power than Liston? Definitely not. Great punching power? Yes. But not Liston level power. A common opponent of Lewis and Naseem Hamed said Naseem hit harder than Lewis. If he was a common opponent of Naseem Hamed, and let's say Iron Mike Tyson. He wouldn't of said anything like that Lewis was very big and tall due to modern nutrition, and his punching power was heightened significantly, but he's not the god you're trying to make him out to be.
     
  12. swagdelfadeel

    swagdelfadeel Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Hey Janitor! Who do you think hit harder?
     
  13. janitor

    janitor VIP Member Full Member

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    Now you are asking!

    There is legitimate crossover of opponents.

    Most people, who shared a ring with Liston and Foreman, gave the edge to Liston.

    Cleveland Williams was also compared favourably to foreman, by the people on the business end.

    Foreman fought into the 90s, and testimonies of his power are still impressive.

    I don’t think anybody said “Foreman hit hard, but Lewis/Bowe were in a different class”.

    So in summary, I don’t want to be hit by any of these dreadnoughts, and I can’t see much to separate them.
     
  14. lufcrazy

    lufcrazy requiescat in pace Full Member

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    I don't think he's a god. I just think he punches harder than Liston.
     
  15. Vanboxingfan

    Vanboxingfan Obsessed with Boxing Full Member

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    Which is my gut feeling also. :good