Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Qinglong, Feb 22, 2022.
Keep in mind how old Sonny was at the time of the loss ..
Are you serious dude ?
Sonny Liston bootlicking is going a bit too far...
Riddick Bowe 4th round KO.
No doubt they would have helped Floyd. But that Bowe was facing a man taking them is no sleight on Riddick, indeed it adds to the lustre of his wins over Holyfield (assuming he wasn't juicing himself), that he beat not only an excellent boxer but one with an unfair advantage at the outset.
By the same token, if Floyd had been taking steroids, it would have only made what Sonny did more impressive, assuming he could have replicated the massacre that he turned in against a clean Patterson.
Almost as effective as Sonny's mob contacts
FWIW, I have this for Sonny. I think he can stand up to what Bowe dishes out. Riddick was a heavy-handed and clubbing rather than concussive puncher and I think prime Sonny takes that.
However, Sonny's hook was concussive. And Bowe's defence was such that at some point it lands. I don't go along with the view that Bowe was super durable. I never saw any evidence of that against a top drawer banger.
He showed amazing heart but that is different - he was all but out from one shot from an ailing Holyfield who had never shown the kind of top tier heavyweight power that Sonny possesses. And that's what it comes down to. Both will fight and both will get hit but my feeling is that Sonny can take what Riddick brings better than vice versa. In a great fight, Liston's the one left standing and the fans warm to the brave loser more in defeat than they ever did in victory so Riddick knows how Evander must have felt back in 92.
Sure, I did note in my post that Liston was in his mid to late 30s at least. We can also add that Liston wasn’t taking the greatest care of himself outside the ring…all in all some loss of resilience but still a cracker of a punch from Martin.
Well… one of them was never stopped before. The other was stopped three times.
Please engage in a debate with me as to why my position is flawed as opposed to resorting to insults.
At least Furey is arguing his case.
You can say that about anyone but it means absolutely nothing without context. Chuvalo was stopped twice, does Bowe have a better chin than him?
I wonder how a 34 year old (minimum) Bowe does against the GOAT, or how a 40 year old version does against Martin? On the other hand, a 28, and 29 year old Liston would've undoubtedly wiped the floor with Golota, and certainly wouldn't need to get off the canvas to do so.
That was honestly one of the most brutal combos I've ever seen! I still wince thinking about it.
Um what? I'll give you, that some defenses of his were less than stellar, and that he didn't exactly go out of his way to fight guys like Machen, and Folly but to say he was "never really that great" is absurd. He became the first heavyweight in history to regain the heavyweight championship, and did so after coming back from one of the most brutal KOs ever seen which very few would've been able to do.
On top of that, he also beat more ranked fighters in his career than Foreman did in a career spanning nearly 30 years, and stayed in the top ten longer than anyone else in heavyweight history which takes a special type of consistency.
He also would've been the first heavyweight to regain the title three times if not for such a blatant robbery.
Muhammad Ali also called Patterson the most skilled fighter he'd ever faced which is quite the compliment considering everybody he'd ever been in the ring with.
I agree Holyfield was better than Patterson, but to say Patterson was "never really that great" is beyond absurd. He is by far better than anyone on Bowe's list of kos,, let alone those knocked out in a single round.
Thanks Bert. Always good to have your endorsement. I know I must be on the right track.
What is the basis behind this? Bowe knocked out 4 people of any significance in fourth or before. Neither were on the level below Liston. Two of them, were ultra shot (Ferguson, and Bowe), Cooper was an alcoholic, drug addict, a blown up cruiser, and a trial horse at best. Seldon? Enough said.