Sonny Liston vs. Vitali Klitschko

I wasn't comparing American football to boxing, only noting in both sports the athletes have gotten so much bigger that the old-timers, even if large in their day, would be very small today.

The difference is that I have never heard any football fan use the size argument to dismiss teams or players from the old days.

That argument only seems mainstream among boxing fans.

I was interested in whether Mendoza would view legacy as the critical factor in judging NFL teams, or use his boxing argument of immediately switching every discussion to size.

 

I don't follow football apart from boxing I like Rugby. American Football without the helmets and armour or stop starts every five minutes.

 

No you wouldn't. You would be sh it at it just like you are now. Just like everything else your emphasis would be on size and strength, not skill ( hence the stupid helmets and armour in that game you play that lasts all day ) which is paramount in football.

Messi's stature is his greatest strength. Due to his low centre of gravity he has tremendous balance, which is why he can run at pace with the ball appearing to be glued to his feet, and bypass big soppy defenders as though they are dustbins.

 

The world could be thankful as our best male athletes steer clear of futbol/soccer, otherwise the USA would be better at it. You can see this in the women's game. In soccer the best player in the world Messi, at 5 feet, 7 inches. Same height as Tommy Burns! This would never happen most sports.

1 ) Messi would not be able to play American Football, Baseball, ice Hockey, or basketball. He's too small!

2 ) In high school sports, Soccer and American football are played at the same time in the Fall. Those who can't play American football give soccer a try.

3 ) Soccer is a fringe sport here. The average sports fan does not care about men's soccer, yet the USA is decent at it. USA women however do not make a lot of money in team sports, and do play soccer. And the USA women won the world cup.

If the USA men could not make money in team sports and wanted to play soccer, they would be right up there with Germany, Brazil, Argentina, etc...

 

Your reply is irrelevant to Foxy's post.:huh

 

also not true regarding baseball. There are players in the major leagues today who are shorter than Messi's listed height of 5' 7", including all-stars.

But it interesting that no matter what the issue, it comes back with Mendoza focusing on size

 

I value size, speed, power and skills in sports. A good big man usually beats a good little man in most sports, soccer might be an exception.

To clarify my position I find Futbol to be a bit of a girly man sport. You can't use your hands. There's an offsides rule used for defense, and players often fake an injury to get cards. The game is easy to play and understand, which is why 4-5 years old children can play it, but not other USA sports.

These 0-0, 1-0, 1-1, or a tie shoot out to me says the skills on the field even if one team has more than the other are not always enough to make a difference in the game. In other sports when a good team play a bad team, the good team scores far more often,

My point is if the USA did not have world class athletes playing football, basketball, or baseball, their FIFA soccer team for men would be much better than it is today. That should be a given. In addition there is little money in the USA playing soccer here.

 

Ed,

The average height of MLB players is just over 6’1″.

The difference between the tallest players (pitchers) and shortest players (2nd Base ) is three inches.

This suggest 5'7" players in MLB are very rare, and if there are any, they only play certain spots.

 

"they only play certain spots"

middle infield (short & second base), outfield, and pitcher. That is six of the nine field positions.

Just google the shortest major league players 2014 and you will get a list.

There were at least ten players in 2014 who were 5' 8" or shorter.

6' 1" by the way, is not that tall by modern standards, and would be short for most football positions, and in basketball. But that is the average, implying that half the players are shorter, some much shorter, than that.

The shortest current major league player is Jose Altuve, at 5' 5"--he was an all-star in 2012.
------------------------------------------------------------------

I did find some interesting facts about the size of baseball players.

In the 1870's, the average major league player was 5' 9" and weighed about 170 lbs.

in the 2000's, the average major league player was 6' 1" and weighed 190 lbs.

The gap isn't as much as one would think, is it.

The average height of an adult male in the 2000's is 5' 10.5"--the average weight is close to 190.

 

"argument about footballers between two Americans"

I was talking baseball, and that Mendoza was in error about his claims about height being necessary in baseball.

Don't claim to know anything about world football.

 

"I value speed, power, and skills in sports."

Speed and skill are just as likely to be found in a small man.

The problem with a sport like boxing is that size negates these--all kinds of ordinary heavyweights could probably have beaten Sugar Ray Robinson at his best.

But the ordinary heavyweights aren't generally much fun to watch exactly because of their lack of skill.

It is not surprising to me that the Floyd-Manny fight is stirring up a lot more interest among the general public than all the recent heavyweight fights put together.

 

Fixed.

 

Liston would walk through Viali. Liston in his prime was a killer. No chance the fight goes the distance.