SRL vs Pernel

Discussion in 'Classic Boxing Forum' started by Mark Dunham, Apr 17, 2022.


  1. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,664
    890
    Mar 19, 2021
    Dran was a lightweight and he beat Leonard

    Camacho was a jr lightweight and he dominated Ray en route to a knockout

    I dont see how you could even consider writing that post knowing Ray was whipped by smaller men

    so yes, Pernell does indeed have a very good chance of coming out on top

    STYLES

    Not size, styles

    Duran and Camacho proved that
     
  2. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,664
    890
    Mar 19, 2021
    I'm glad you asked that question. Terry had more than just four wins worth mentioning

    Leonard

    Taylor

    Mugabi

    Curry

    Brown

    Hall of famers all and he did so without working up a sweat

    Norris was PURE SPEED. Indomitable. Supremely confident. Beyond reckoning

    quite possibly the best ever at his weight

    He has the resume to back it up
     
  3. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,664
    890
    Mar 19, 2021


    Not quite true but nice try anyways.

    You did not bother to mention the surrounding circumstances that signaled their demise - strenuous bouts that included beatings, and usually fluctuating weight.

    Both did in Roy Jones

    So far Monzon's career goes, Monzon actually quit the sport altoghter not because "he started struggling" but because he'd been champion for 7 years and so far as I could tell, beat his closest rival by more or less the same score and simply ran out of competition

    What's he going to do, run from Alan Minter?

    Rudy Robles?

    Sugar Ray Seales?
     
  4. Pugguy

    Pugguy Ingo, The Thinking Man’s GOAT banned Full Member

    17,860
    28,890
    Aug 22, 2021
    Don’t worry folks, on another thread, I already provided evidence to Mr Dunham, that Terry Norris HIMSELF said that Ray was NO longer the fighter he ONCE WAS even BEFORE Terry stepped into the ring with Ray.

    I mean, Terry was stating the BLEEDING OBVIOUS anyway but since it didn’t fit into his already deeply flawed “narrative” on Ray, Mr Dunham took it a non-sensical step further by shamelessly ignoring Mr Norris’ OWN far better informed and educated opinion.
     
    Flash24 and Loudon like this.
  5. Cobra33

    Cobra33 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    14,082
    13,404
    Feb 2, 2006

    Just wow. Lets see:

    Mugabi was beyond shot.
    Taylor?? The little Jr.welterweight(5'6) who moved up to cash out? The Taylor who was damaged by Chavez?
    Curry???? The one who lost to Jaquot TWO years earlier and had just been stopped by Nunn at Middle?
    Brown??? The one who brutalized Terry the first time?????


    MY GOD man come on please.
    Let me help you because you actually aren't a real Norris fan after all.

    Vs Quincy Taylor - the same Taylor who went to win a World title latter on. It was a battle of two prospects on ESPN. Good fight.
    Vs Jorge Castro - this win was before Castro went on to win a world title and was an excellent win by Terry.
    Vs Carl Daniels - Daniels was unbeaten slick southpaw and Terry over came him to stop him. Daniels was a world class boxer at that time.
    Vs Paul Vaden- Baden was unbeaten at the time and a champion. He was thought to be a very stern test for Terry and some thought Vaden would win. Terry dominated him.

    There. School has ended. Next time study more before you post.
     
    Flash24 and Loudon like this.
  6. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,664
    890
    Mar 19, 2021
     
  7. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,664
    890
    Mar 19, 2021
    What names are you expecting, sugar Ray Leonard?

    I like Norris because he beats the big names

    Mugabi COULDNT be washed up. He was only 30and holding a belt

    Taylor was 25 and holding a belt

    Curry is a name any SRl fan wished they could see on Leonard's resume and is much better than a Lalonde

    and the domination of Brown only proves the first fight was just a fluke

    With so many dominating wins, this proves the win over Leonard was not sue to any reason other than Terry was too fast for Ray to formulate any kid of successful plan and that what we were seeing was one very fast boxer being outsped by an even faster boxer

    watch it again. sometimes you have to watch it several times to really appreciate terry's prowess

    It was unbelievable. Terry made it looks so easy and I felt truly blessed to see Roy Jones continue the legacy of speed
     
  8. Cobra33

    Cobra33 Boxing Junkie Full Member

    14,082
    13,404
    Feb 2, 2006
    Taylor was a WELTERWEIGHT.
    Mugabi fought only three more times - beat up 2 journey men then got iced by Gerald.
    Hardly in his "prime"
    Curry was so trashed it isn't even funny - for the life of me I can't see how he qualified for a shot especially considering he just go stopped by Nunn at MIDDLEWEIGHT.
     
  9. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,664
    890
    Mar 19, 2021
    Taylor was welter but you forget that Norris came down

    Norris even came down to meet him half way to help him out and he STILL mopped the floor with Fastest hands ever Mel Taylor

    LOL! No matter how you try to tear him down, you can't.

    Mugabi was actually champion when Terry wrested the championship from him and notice that Terry whipped him BEFORE Gerald got to him, not AFTER.

    GET IT NOW???

    As for Curry, he just could never get past a certain level of competition, starting with Honeyghan

    We can actually put Norris in the same proud company as McCallum & Nunn

    Your arguments hold no water no matter what you try and no matter how desperate you become to explain away how Terry beat legends, without working up a sweat
     
  10. Turnip mk3

    Turnip mk3 Active Member Full Member

    941
    1,026
    Feb 6, 2021
    SRL late . Too much power . Good fight
     
  11. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,664
    890
    Mar 19, 2021
    I've never really seen Pernell hurt and is an outstanding defensive fighter

    Leonard's not known as a boxer with great power who takes a guy out with one or two shots like a George Foreman. He usually traps them with a delivery of blinding shots (see Chiaverini and Price)

    so this does not add up

    A more likely scenario is that Leonard will sting him on occasion and I don't see him being able to score consistently enough to pull ahead on the cards

    I see Pernell dictating the action, moving the way he wants and making Leonard do what he wants (styles)
     
  12. jabber74

    jabber74 Active Member Full Member

    1,003
    1,053
    Oct 5, 2012
    I was a fan of Terry Norris, but he did beat a lot of washed-up names:

    Mugabi fought an entire career in one fight against Hagler and was never the same.
    Meldrick Taylor fought an entire career in one fight against Chavez and was on the downslide after that.
    Curry had his bubble burst by Honeyghan and then iced by McCallum and was gone after that.
    The ending for those guys came quick. That's how some careers go in boxing.

    Still, I don't dismiss him as an excellent fighter because of that. I thought Norris had a lot to offer and he was a top-notch talent, but he was also erratic and could be unpredictable.
    He could look sensational like the best fighter in the world one second, then get rocked by a lesser fighter, or get KO'ed or DQ for fouling against a nobody.

    Not trying to diminish a person's achievements, but it is what it is. It sounds like you hold him in an extremely high regard. Yea he was very good, but don't get carried away.
     
  13. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

    13,417
    11,884
    Mar 19, 2012
    You didn't need to.
     
  14. ETM

    ETM I thought I did enough to win. Full Member

    13,417
    11,884
    Mar 19, 2012
    There's a possibility that in the lead up to a fight like this someone may tell Ray Leonard Whitaker fought lefthanded. Leonard may prepare for SweetPea Southpaw stance. Ray had a big brain and he wasn't afraid to use it.
    Just looking at the DelaHoya fight. Pea couldn't do much offensively vs Oscar who had no idea what he was doing or gameplan. A lightweight Whitaker would have won handily but he wasn't as good at Welterweight.
     
    Turnip mk3 likes this.
  15. Mark Dunham

    Mark Dunham Well-Known Member Full Member

    1,664
    890
    Mar 19, 2021
    On the contrary. You are underestimating Mr. norris and then resorting to sensationalism we often find in journalism "fought a career's worth in one fight"

    If that's the case, why not say the same thing about Joe Louis after losing his first fight???

    in fact, you could make the same claim of ANY fighter losing their first fight including Sugar Ray Leonard, terry Norris, Hearns, McCallum, Hagler, Napoles, Tunney, Minter, whoever

    I myself dont believe John was the same fighter in 1990 as he was in 1986 or even 1983

    But the fight was decided so early, how could you really tell what John had left???

    How can you or anyone say how much John had left? Just because he was destroyed by a hook that struck so fast, he didnt see coming???

    He WAS champion so if he fought an entire career against Hagler, how did he wind up winning a championship after the bout???

    The same can be reasoned with Taylor. I dont recall Taylor's career petering out after the Chavez robbery

    He outhit Chavez 20 - 1 until the last round when it was stopped with two seconds left

    I really think it's hard to prove that Taylor was a washed up name and I dont think there are many who would agree with you (if they're being honest)

    Unbeknownst to you, I saw Mel easily outpoint Davis for his second title and at 25 yrs. didnt appear to be showing wear from the Chavez fight

    Should I believe what others say or should I believe my own eyes???

    So if I hold Norris in high regard, it is not a mistake nor an error in judgement and if others dont hold him in the proper light, it's because of their personal biases and that they are in a constant state of denial